November 2026

[Gipfelstuermer]

Preview PDF
November 2026

Races to be designed:



Races to be checked:
Tour de Okinawa



Legend
BLUE = Designer found
GREEN = DONE

[Bugatti]

Need Anden in the morning and maybe we can start on a Monday to not take 3 weekends?

[Hansa]

Need Anden in the morning and maybe we can start on a Monday to not take 3 weekends?

Nah, keep the weekends there much better like this

[Obk]

Need Anden in the morning and maybe we can start on a Monday to not take 3 weekends?

agree! three weekends too hard for me, with kids at home no chance, hehe.

[Hoefs Cycling Team]

I don’t have any chance to play while at work, and at home I have 5 young children and a wife who isn’t supportive (weekends are better for me—poll incoming?)

[toreeto]

I thing to it is better to have less weekends.

[flockmastoR]

1) I dont care so much for Andes, and as it is now for the last couple of years I am more in favor to get rid of it or make a different approach in designing it. Is simply not interessting to ride like that, and I watched some editions of rolling around the last years it cannot be fun to race as well. (No offense to the current designer who also is highly influenced by these past years tendency)
2) Moving the start to monday just gives you 1 weekend race day less as the rest day will then go on a week day
3) Moving Andes messes with all other races as well that are planned around the sport of Andes, personally I would dislike the move of it.

As it is the traditional way to start it on Sat, imo it would need more argumentation to think about moving it than just: Racing during the week fits better for someone.

[NBeullens]

i was also kinda surprised there is no morning edition but that was probably a calculated decision . And for the boring races, let's just have good talks for 2 hours

[Bugatti]

Looking back at recent years, it’s better to skip other times of day rather than the morning.
last 4 years of anden:
9h average 7 teams
14h average 4,75 teams
18/19h average 7 teams
21/22h average 6,75 teams

The morning is by far the most popular time, so we can schedule the anden for the morning as well? preferably at 10h, since it has been at 9h for the past four years.

[Berlin Marks]

Overall it looks like we shouldn’t ride that shit at all

[Tukhtahuaev]

I am very much against the option of moving Andes, when the date was clearly communicated in the offseason plan. I would probably have big issues if it is moved to a later date.

Regarding the times I have mixed feelings. Participation probably doesn't really warrant more than 3 times and a lot of morning teams usually can switch to the afternoon too, but not offering the morning still feels a bit wrong

[flockmastoR]

Looking back at recent years, it’s better to skip other times of day rather than the morning.
last 4 years of anden:
9h average 7 teams
14h average 4,75 teams
18/19h average 7 teams
21/22h average 6,75 teams

The morning is by far the most popular time, so we can schedule the anden for the morning as well? preferably at 10h, since it has been at 9h for the past four years.

Was also curious so I checked and saw that last year afternoon had more than morning (on a low count). Generally, I also think it's either morning or afternoon to get cut, also as there is a rather big group that can potentially ride both). My feeling would be to cut afternoon. As am afternoon team I would prefer to cut afternoon as it would mean better one day race participation.

Question is: why the cut in the first place? The numbers are somehow constant in the Andes.

[Robyklebt]

Dropping the Andes in the morning looks very weird. Also is very weird. Just leave it at 4 editions. Thanks to the Falcor-wave we still have more active managers than a year ago (even if the wave effect is dropping, overall we're still much more active). Andes being a specialized Tour (probably using the word extreme (as I did in the past too) is wrong, since it leads designers to believe it needs extreme stages, it's extreme in the sense that it's not balanced, but ultra-specialized) the interest after an initial wave of popularity was always limited, even with more active managers we won't even get to the also disappointing, but a bit less, numbers of the Dec tour. It has become a niche-Tour, where you can expect 5-10 teams, everything more is a success. Keep it at 4, and if then you have a mini-edition where everybody is whining about it and wants out you still can cut it (unless that brings charges of advantagism). Just make it clear before the start, editions with less than 5 teams (or 5 teams included, make it clear) risk being cancelled if a simple majority is for it and the bosses feel like it.

Times, constant 18/19-21/22 back and forth in the last years, morning has been 9 since 2019, afternoon has been 14 since 2020 (well, dropped oncem no edition in 21). That's ok if the reason is that due to the length too often races take over 2h, so for office players it's goes into the lunch break or end of work. But that was 6-7-8-8 from 25-22(counting the sprint that isn't counted in the official time given and sometimes counting 120 sometimes not, forgot which one I wanted to do) Giro 5-8-6-5(6)-4 (This time from 22-26 the order) (mistakes of course possible) So it's not really impossible to ride races at 10-15 even if they take more than 2h. This year looks like 8 btw. So IMO 10 or 15 wouldn't really be completely impossible.
Ok, maybe 2h30 stages are more relevant, not going to check the Giro again, but suppose we don't get those there usually, while we do have 2 in the Andes this year (the other 6 are 2h03'-2h13'). (Giro occasionally had 250km stages, 240+, which then of course probably goes close to 2h30 too) Hm, probably 2025 would have been the year for a change with no 2h30'+ stage. Anyway, 9-14 as fix (except for the morning getting 0 for no discernable reason) might have a reason in the length, but is it compelling enough to have it every year? Btw, I'm thinking about rejoining the Andes after years of not riding, and if I do, 14h being 22h and 15h being 23h for me, 14h would be way better for me. But only thinking

Cutting the Andes? I've asked for that years ago... by now I'm for keeping it. I want to ride at least one decent Andes design before it's retired...

[Robyklebt]

Looking back at recent years, it’s better to skip other times of day rather than the morning.
last 4 years of anden:
9h average 7 teams
14h average 4,75 teams
18/19h average 7 teams
21/22h average 6,75 teams

The morning is by far the most popular time, so we can schedule the anden for the morning as well? preferably at 10h, since it has been at 9h for the past four years.

Ok, can we just ban Bugatti? I mean there's idiocy, there's stupidity, there's a lot of things and there's this.
9h average 7 teams
18/19h average 7 teams
21/22h average 6,75 teams
The morning is by far the most popular time,
It's not by far the most popular time. It's the most popular time together with 18/19 and by 0.25 (which probably means 1 team over 4 years?) over the evening. To claim "by far" is just so bloody fucking incredibly stupid. Work with the facts, which you did with the averages, if you then aren't able to interpret them correctly just let it be.

[Robyklebt]

I am very much against the option of moving Andes, when the date was clearly communicated in the offseason plan. I would probably have big issues if it is moved to a later date.

Regarding the times I have mixed feelings. Participation probably doesn't really warrant more than 3 times and a lot of morning teams usually can switch to the afternoon too, but not offering the morning still feels a bit wrong

IMO the offseason plan shouldn't be final, it should be an overview that gives a general idea of what is planned. Final decision here, that's why we get to comment. If now there's a wave of "let's start Monday".. could be changed. My vote would be to stay as it is here, start Sat. But to keep that nice week without stage race there and whole. But nothing in the preview should be final. Actually I'll head over there right now to propose some other changes...

Cut afternoon instead of morning. Yes, if there's a cut, yes. Other option would be to keep it at 4 as the last years. With more managers active in general... we might get a similar number of participants as last year, which actually was a pretty good year for the Andes I think.

[Bugatti]

The morning is by far the most popular time

That second statement wasn't specifically about the Andes. Maybe I should have mentioned that.

[Robyklebt]

09:00 Uhr 22 269

From September... to now? Or what? The list seems very weird anyway.

Just 9h:
September I counted 11 races with 117 teams. This month 9 with 100 so far. Ok might have miscounted, very probably have somewhere but that would be 20 races with 217 teams over this 1 month and a half. Still don't see what this 22 269 is or comes from. Regardless of all that, if we're talking overall the evening is the most popular time. 21-22 And no, I'm not going to count that.

[Bugatti]

09:00 Uhr 22 269

From September... to now? Or what? The list seems very weird anyway.

Just 9h:
September I counted 11 races with 117 teams. This month 9 with 100 so far. Ok might have miscounted, very probably have somewhere but that would be 20 races with 217 teams over this 1 month and a half. Still don't see what this 22 269 is or comes from. Regardless of all that, if we're talking overall the evening is the most popular time. 21-22 And no, I'm not going to count that.

you are right. i removed it
need to talk to my KI

[flockmastoR]

09:00 Uhr 22 269

From September... to now? Or what? The list seems very weird anyway.

Just 9h:
September I counted 11 races with 117 teams. This month 9 with 100 so far. Ok might have miscounted, very probably have somewhere but that would be 20 races with 217 teams over this 1 month and a half. Still don't see what this 22 269 is or comes from. Regardless of all that, if we're talking overall the evening is the most popular time. 21-22 And no, I'm not going to count that.

you are right. i removed it
need to talk to my KI

it tells you what you want to hear

[Robyklebt]

need to talk to my KI

Talk to RKLI, most reliable non-human intelligence around. Called DI as well.

[Nomorelulz]

Seeing participation at Andes for the last years all under 10 teams per race and also having in mind multiple teams are not so much in favor of the current andes profiles I think having 3 editions, hopefully around 10 teams, is a good way. And considering the numbers and also the "flexibility" of morning/afternoon teams imo it makes sense to cut one of the morning/afternoon editions. Especially when most of the newer guys werde favoring the evening times too. (see most recent tours f.e. 20h = 19 teams, 22h = 16 teams).

For every discussion about editions we always say its better to have less editions than too much throughout the year, why shouldnt this also count for andes.

[drei.zehn]

To have less race days at weekends is always a good thing imo.
Cutting morning Andes is a hard decision, then better keep it at 4 editions..

…BUT have to add here that I most likely won’t ride it this year with that design.

[Gipfelstuermer]

Last years, I was usually too optimistic about Andes participation. When numbers were generally low, we kept Andes as a tradition in the calendar, but the sort of 5 teams editions can be quite boring. Then when numbers improved, we kept 4 editions, but even the sort of 7-8 teams editions lead to passive racing mostly. Perhaps this contributed to some lethargy around what used to be a big highlight in the calendar.

So I would like to try and have 10+ teams in each edition, so that there is hopefully more action in the races. Even if numbers are marginally higher than last year, I am only confident to achieve that with 3 editions. Between morning and afternoon it's tough call. I put afternoon as last year it had marginally better participation but I get the point that in previous years morning was stronger.

More opinions welcome (but feels like it will be a tough call for me between morning/afternoon).

[Robyklebt]

I think the Andes are generally niche, have been a for a long time. An early boom from 06 to...? But then pretty fast participation became low relative to the general participation. I rode most editions from 2011-2020, missed 15 and 19, no idea why, and remember that even in the early ones, when we had still more active managers it was mostly a Bergwerk-Donkey duel, at least 2 years. Others there, but not too many. Later of course with dwindling general numbers even lower, 2020 then it was just Gaurain and me in the afternoon, we managed to get Luques to have it cancelled. I then stpoped riding it, somehow was boring, won 6 of 8 of those editions I participated from 11-20, with lower and lower numbers, just wasn't interesting anymore. It was always a bit niche, (except those very early years) but of course general number of active managers plays a role too. But even if we had double the numbers I'm not sure we could really hope for 10+ groups really.


Ok, change of plans, instead of the drive by post that was almost finished already, we're going to get some numbers:

Some stats about participation: How many races with 10+ teams in October, how many races offered, to see a bit about general activity (and have partial data for 26) ingame and then how many teams in Andes: Ok, November too. Then Andes by edition, morning to evening, total

October 19: 69/152 - November 25/144 - Andes 8 4 5 7, total 24
October 20: 77/158 - November 40/156 - Andes 6 2 14 14 total 36
October 21: 12/139 - November 4/133 - Andes 7 - 7 9 total 23
October 22: 44/135 - November 25/134 - Andes 5 1 7 4 total 17
October 23:69/141 - November 64/137 - Andes 7 5 4 5 total 21
October 24: 98/148 - November 84/135 - Andes 9 5 10 9 total 33
October 25: 96/142 - November 89/135 - Andes 7 8 7 9 total 31
October 26: 84/152 or 84/107, since 45 races (starting from tomorrow) haven't been ridden yet

Numbers are clearly up, the way it looks we'll have the best October (regarding +10 races) in a looong time. Also already 46 races with 15+ teams, it was 29 for the whole month in 2025

Andes and general activity, Donks a bit confused by some stuff. 19 seems a rather standard number comparable to what we had in the years before I guess, 16-18 when I rode it might have been slightly higher, but we kept losing teams at the time.
20 we had the Covid-boost the whole year, by then was waning a bit already, still highest Andes in the 7 years covered by the calendar. Probably comebackers that remembered the golden years and wanted to ride it again?
21 was full flash crisis I suppose, all low but surprisingly the andes did comparatively well.
22 - 25 then the correlation between general activity and Andes seems more stable, also the offseason activity loss doesn't seem huge in the last years, unlike 19+20. 26 might be different with the wavelings of course, we don't know yet how excited they get by the offseason, and of course the wavelings are leaving too, no idea about our retention rate.

So, purely from general number IMO 4 editions would be ok. Depending on your expectations, again, I think Andes has been a niche race for a long time, it will always have below average participation, so even if we had double the numbers we have I wouldn't be overly optimistic to get 10+ participants in each edition. So yes, I always have low expectations for the Andes, Gipfel seems to have higher expectations. But purely from the numbers above and the clear increase we had this year, I'd say 4 editions ok.

But of course it's not only numbers, it's the route as well. This one hasn't received an overly warm welcome, Dreizehn already announced to be an unlikely participant, others maybe too. Maybe ask a bit around if people plan to ride? And again, one solution would be pragmatism, if you go for 4 editions. Actually for 3 editions too. Just announce a fix number of teams that is needed for the Andes to go on, less than that cancelled. And a second threshold where teams can demand a cancellation if a majority agrees. Less than 5 teams, race is cancelled before it starts. 5-6 teams, the teams can vote if they want to ride it or not, ideally during the first stage, a la limite before the start of the second one, Something like that. Special races can have special rules. Ok, could then fuck some teams, starts afternoon, cancelled ,would have started morning if he knew that... that's the risk.

3 editions: Of course if we were to get 37 teams total with 4 editions, record, modern times record, it's not like the same 37 will start in 3 editions, the morning/afternoon flexibility seems a bit overstated to me here. There's morning people I only see when I do a 1 day race in the morning as well.

Anyway, if you go for 3 editions, the decision to cut the afternoon is really easy, don't think the morning should even be in the discussion. Both evenings too, don't think they can be cancelled. The afternoon yes, while it has now recovered a bit 5 5 8 the last 3 years, it's not like 5 is a good number. 2025 was the only good one, the only argument to keep it. Which is there, but not at the expense of another time. That would be the argument to keep it at 4, afternoon deserves a chance after doing ok in 25. But if it's 3. No, cutting the afternoon is the only sensible option.

Maybe would be helpful if afternoon people, also morning people could tell if they plan to ride the Andes... and if yes if only morning/afternoon or both ok?
I start:
Big Donkey 55% chances to ride, 14h more likely than 15h, everything else no. More people riding increases percentages of course. Looking at the profiles again probably decreases chances, so I'll avoid doing that.

Ah, morning teams 2025
Bugatti
L RSV
Alkworld
SV Furpach
r FSCL
Dreizehn unlikely
Vives le velos

Already put the unlikely to Dreizehn.

Afternoon teams:
Tukhtahuaev
Falcor
Ansach
Schnuggeritos
Alpacas
Wolfpack Cycling Team
Lotto-Soudal
Bright

Would think Falcor is a no..

Maybe people can specifically ask those teams about their provisional Andes plans, while encouraging others to come forward too if they plan to ride it?

Ah, one more thing. Any of the admins has access to old data? It's not actually important, but just out of curiosity would like to know the Andes participation in earlier times, ideally 06-18, but just 10-18 or so would be ok too. If you can find those numbers without having to spend hours and hours. Not actually important for the discussion here, just personal curiosity. Also to know how faulty my memory is, since I think participation was already low(ish) in the early 2010s...