Samyn 10:00 - pavé/time bug

[chartreusecycle]

Seems that the pavé/time bug (when riders dropped from peloton come front after the pavé) happen this morning at Samyn GP

[Robyklebt]

Yep.
Only at the 1 pavé -3 kms.
110 km Nothing, everybody in tempo
135 km Peloton not in tempo, gained 2'09" to the front. 3 "leaders" in tempo in front, green. Further back a group with 1 guy in red stayed at the same time to the front.
160 km Peloton in tempo, group dropped behind, one got back to the peloton, was 2'34" back, a group further back won around the same.
185km Group at 22'03 gained 8 minutes. A rider at 21'56" going green stayed at 21'56"

So to me it seems: (Maybe I'm telling stuff that is already widely known, but first time I was actually in a race where this happened) Groups/riders NOT in tempo. are faster than riders in tempo. And possibly as well that everything is the other way around on these km. The faster you go, the slower you actually are. Meaning red is rather slower than blue or green, or at least no difference, see experiment at 185, the guy at 21'56" went at the same pace then the peloton, peloton red and fresher guys in tempo, back green and weaker. (But ok, didn't win time, so maybe that theory is wrong)

[luques]

I insert tonight a pavè race for short races, the aim is to use it as test for pavè bugs, wanted to do it before but had no time.

If the problem is only the -3, than I guess we can substitute with -2 / -4 without big problems no?

[luques]

In short races at the moment there is only 1 race available that is pavè, in order to see what the problem is.
If you have time and want to test a bit, play it and report.

[Robyklebt]

Just to clarify, don't think the problem is only -3... it's just that in Le Samyn there were no -2 or -4 or steeper downhills. The bug seems to happen generally in downhills, so I guess all from a certain percentage.

[Robyklebt]

OK, seems pretty clear:
Pavé and -3 or more downhill: Bug, time gain, for riders not in tempo. Only been in races with 1 pavé, so only there sure, will try to get into the pavé test race again later.... but suspect the same thing at more than 1 pavé.

[luques]

OK, seems pretty clear:
Pavé and -3 or more downhill: Bug, time gain, for riders not in tempo. Only been in races with 1 pavé, so only there sure, will try to get into the pavé test race again later.... but suspect the same thing at more than 1 pavé.

So also, -4 -5 -6 but not -1 / -2?
If you have some short race or track you want to try to test let me know and I put that one online.

[Robyklebt]

On * yes, starts at -3
No idea how it is at ** etc.

[Joy]

OK, seems pretty clear:
Pavé and -3 or more downhill: Bug, time gain, for riders not in tempo. Only been in races with 1 pavé, so only there sure, will try to get into the pavé test race again later.... but suspect the same thing at more than 1 pavé.

So also, -4 -5 -6 but not -1 / -2?
If you have some short race or track you want to try to test let me know and I put that one online.

ok,i did about 25-30 short races PaveTest and have a few conclusions
the bug "works" for: -only non tempo rider/groups
- downhill * or ** or *** (in PaveTest bug was 1time km16 -4* about 6-7 times km19 -3*** and mostly on km23 -3*)
I am almost convinced that the groups are getting ahead in the same order (not 100% convinced 'cause is pretty hard to remeber all those Autobot Names,even though I have noted the groups several times)
hope it helps...will test more

[Joy]

OK, seems pretty clear:
Pavé and -3 or more downhill: Bug, time gain, for riders not in tempo. Only been in races with 1 pavé, so only there sure, will try to get into the pavé test race again later.... but suspect the same thing at more than 1 pavé.

So also, -4 -5 -6 but not -1 / -2?
If you have some short race or track you want to try to test let me know and I put that one online.

ok,i did about 25-30 short races PaveTest and have a few conclusions
the bug "works" for: -only non tempo rider/groups
- downhill * or ** or *** (in PaveTest bug was 1time km16 -4* about 6-7 times km19 -3*** and mostly on km23 -3*)
I am almost convinced that the groups are getting ahead in the same order (not 100% convinced 'cause is pretty hard to remeber all those Autobot Names,even though I have noted the groups several times)
hope it helps...will test more

here are some prints
https://prnt.sc/ioeoxe sieb km1
https://prnt.sc/ioepf9 groups after the sieb
https://prnt.sc/ioepts groups
https://prnt.sc/ioepzz no bug on a -2*
https://prnt.sc/ioeq3v no bug on a -1*
https://prnt.sc/ioeqda bug on a -3*
https://prnt.sc/ioeqn0 all groups in tempo
https://prnt.sc/ioeqzn sieb
https://prnt.sc/ioer6n groups after the sieb
km 16 no bug even if Disney nontempo ....thought he will "receive bug"
https://prnt.sc/ioermc all groups in tempo bug doesnt work anymore safe race till the end

[luques]

Thanks for all the tests! Surely it helps, also designers to understand how to avoid the problem until isn't fixed.

I will try to upload some pavè races more to have more alternatives to test.

[Pokemon Club]

Thanks for all the tests! Surely it helps, also designers to understand how to avoid the problem until isn't fixed.

I will try to upload some pavè races more to have more alternatives to test.

remove all cobbles on downhill on upcoming races so

[Robyklebt]

Test rave with
-** downhill
-*** downhill
-**** downhill
-***** downhill
-* downhill steeper than -6
Would be useful.

[Robyklebt]

After riding 2 test races as well:

My impression is that you can't jump ahead of the first group.

And if the first group is NOT in tempo, basically the whole races "freezes" for that km, no change at all in time gaps. The first group doesn't gain ground on a peloton that makes tempo, or on anybody else.

ps Anton Hasler is dominating this shit.