End of Tour money for tours with less than 10 teams

[Robyklebt]

The 70% rule doesn't work.... got looooooooots of money, more than seemed possible, short check and... yep, Campeonato de los Andes 2012 15h, start with 7 team so 70% got 100% of the "end of tour" money. Which shouldn't happen.

CHANGE it finally, we "discovered" that problem in the Vuelta 08. Buhmann announced that it would be corrected. It's still there... Fascinating that nobody of the hundreds of participants of tours with less than 10 teams ever noticed that since then.

[NoPikouze]

shouldn't it be 9*7=63% only ?

[Robyklebt]

No it shouldn't. That bug has been corrected, or that rule changed actually. Works during the race and 1 day races, 70%

But this bug really should be corrected. stage races always risk giving out too much money, but then giving 100% of the GC money at the end of the tour regardless of the teams at the start, just "unbalances" the relation between 1 day races and stage races too much. Even without bug I win 1,239 million, with the bug 1,770, 531'000 too much. Take that money away manually, don't care, but correct the bug.

[Robyklebt]

Mmh, my next stage race finishes tomorrow.... 9 teams at the start, but I'm earning myself dumb and ladyly again! Final GC will give 100%, should be only 90%... not as bad as Andes, but still. And ok, it's 9 teams but really 8, since ornyorny is here with 2 teams this time... one might be banned, he only rides with one.. but ok, that's another topic really. But would be nice if the GC money bug would be corrected until tomorrow, even if this time it will only be 10% unfair gain... But in the end it distorts the whole game somehow...

edit: Of course it would be ideal if the money was calculated with the teams that actually finish the tour, so only 8, might be even only 6 after tomorrow... but if that's to much programming ok, can be done later... but GC money according to starting teams like in stages hopefully is not too much work?

[Alkworld]

edit: Of course it would be ideal if the money was calculated with the teams that actually finish the tour, so only 8, might be even only 6 after tomorrow...

I don't think that would be a good idea, as in your example you also pay a higher salary and receive higher premiums in the beginning of the tour and would then get only reduced premiums at the end of the race, while you were riding most of the time in a bigger field. In practice, in most cases this might be ok, but I could create a scenario where you are totally fucked while winning everything

[Robyklebt]

Don't really think so, but maybe could happen?
But basically I was only talking about GC money, not stages money... stages stay at whatever percentages you start with, ok, why not. A group of 12 with 6 guys offline in the end is not harder then a group of 8 without offliners... so ok, for stages ok. But the GC money could easily be made dependent on the finishing teams. Those that weren't taken out or kicked out. Don't really think you could get fucked over that really, even if you end the tour alone... you still get 10% and that's really more than the win is probably worth. Ah, teams out I don't mean teams that had all their riders eliminated, but teams that were kicked by offline rules or taken out of the tour for whatever reason.

But anyway, at least Buh should correct the bug, right now the GC money is 100%. Stages works, not the GC money, so put it down to the starting teams.. (even if I think finishing would be better, but ok..)

[Pirkio]

May I have a question?

In what year you think we start racing for win 0€? Maybe 2014?

[Robyklebt]

886'215 won in November and December thanks to the bug. Thanks! But maybe we could think of taking that bug out sooner or later? Don't think he really helps the game in any way...
The simple solution, % of teams started is ok. I would have won shitloads of money like that too, since I tend to dominate the small groups lately (not sure how that happened, used to lose in both small and medium and big groups, now I win small groups... strange) Anyway, it's not like we wouldn't earn any money without that bug.. GC end of tour money for the ape in the 3 stage races concerned by the bug:

3'173'450
Substract the 886'215 and I still won 2'287'235. That money of course is high too, sooner or later low cat races could be treated differently with regards to prize money. But ok, those 2'287'235 credits were earned "legally". The rest just with a bug, a bug that should really be corrected as soon as possible. And take my money back too if that helps speed the process up! Or my latest star rider.

[Robyklebt]

The bug still exists.
I demand that the TdS 15h with 8 teams get 200 percent of the GC earnings, it's unfair for us if we get only bugged 100% while stage races with 5 teams get the same. I demand 200% for TdS 15h

[Robyklebt]

Buhmann pleaaaaaaase, take that bug out.

May:
Dunkerque 10h: 6 teams
Dunkerque 16h: 9 teams
Grodow..: 12h: 4
Grodow..: 18h: 9
Grodow..: 23h: 3
Giro 15h: 9
Giro 24h: 8
Moscow 11: 9
Picardie 20h: 9
Picardie 24h: 9
California 10h: 7
California 15h: 7
Norway 13: 9
Bayern 9h: 7
Belgique 12h: 5
Belqique 24h: 8

16 stage races in May had less than 10 teams, so they got 70% (!!!!!) to 10% more in final GC money that they should have gotten. As you can see the times that profit most are: The morning, noon, afternoon and late evening. Evening and early evening get "outfinanced", which will make them suffer on the transfer market. Big experienced teams that start in the morning, afternoon etc profit most. They get shitloads of money, since they will be able to get more than the newcomers who start at the same time. Even without the bug that would be the case, but not to this degree.

June?
Same deal:
Dauphiné 11h 9 teams
Suisse 15h 8teams
Lux. 8h: 5
Lux 13h: 8
Lux 24h: 7
Sud 11h: 6
Sud 15h: 8
Sud 19h: 8

Already 8 stage races with the same deal. Will grow with Elektro/Slovenia again.

Yes, one problem is that there is always rather offered one or two editions too many, but the damn bug that we get 100% of the GC money is there anyway. It punishes the evening teams, it punishes the sprinter teams (unless it's a sprinter stage race, which happens too), it punishes less experienced teams. And in the end really fucks up the balance, I'm not even trying to calculate I much I gained from this bug in the last year... Andes, shit races in december etc.

Correct this bug!!! Now!

[Buhmann]

Nice compensation money for the teams...

[Robyklebt]

For which teams?
Don't bother answer, I'll do it:

- For teams that ride in the morning and afternoon
- For strong teams, that means experienced teams mostly. (weaker and newer teams will profit much less from it)
- For teams that ride the parallel program (not always, but often)

Other teams get fucked:
- Teams that ride in the evening
- TEams that can't ride stage races

They will get fucked because certain teams have much more money at their disposal than they should have. I just payed 120% for a classic. TdS GC money: 747'900: Got 149'580 too much. Giro: 1'297'200, got 129'720 too much. Total just for my 2 last stage races: 279'300. That's already almost the 20%... only 60k more missing. How I got those? Easy by profiting from that idiotic bug since November or so, that's when I first posted about it I managed to by more riders, more cheap riders, more good riders, more money riders than without the bug. Riders that increase my profit even in races with more than 10 teams.

It's not nice money, it's not compensation money. It's just "game balance destroying money".

[NoPikouze]

I agree with Klebt...

In a couple of months the profiting teams will be able to buy the good riders in the auctions and become stronger and stronger in the long term... That's not ok.

[sylvainmeteo]

Even if I often have benefits from this, I agree with Roby, stages are ok (under 90 riders roule works) but not for tours , the guys who always in the evening in a full field shouldn't be penalized as it's already a good avantage of money to be in fields of 11/12 teams for example

[luques]

Is this bug fixed?

And what is the rule behind that?

For example today tour of Poitou:

in general today i did 84k in normal condition with more than 10 teams.

I have 58,8k now, it is the 70% and we are in 7teams, i suppose it is

90% for 9 teams
80% for 8 and so on, am i right?

[team fl]

The money after stages is not the problem. It's the money you get after the tour for the different classements that is discussed here.

And to answer this question: No, I guess not.

Edith deliveres the answer to your question: see below

[Robyklebt]

90% for 9 teams
80% for 8 and so on, am i right?

Correct. Works for stages, should be the same for GC, but there it's buggy.

[Alkworld]

This thread needs a revival again. I could finance this answer with the incredible amount of price money at the end of the Campeonato (2.398.400, should have been around 720.000 less) that was printed by the RSF Central Bank.

[Robyklebt]

Didn't need a revival since Buhmann's answers tend to have the ape jump up and down in his cage, hurting his head.

[luques]

I should make some kommunalka teams to fill the 10 teams at tour

[Allagen]

is the bug still in the game?

[team fl]

I took a look under the carpet... and there were a lot of bugs partying and enjoying their life.

[luques]

I took a look under the carpet... and there were a lot of bugs partying and enjoying their life.

And proliferating too?

[team fl]

*push*

Tour of California 11h, 5 teams, 2 got kicked out, 3 left in the end:

- bergwerk got around 1,5 Mio. at the end of the tour winning every classement
- Team FL and ADRIANO FC got around 870k at the end of the tour, without winning a single classement.

This is ridiculous. Please adjust the money at the end of tours according to the number of teams, if there are less than 10 teams. Like it is adjusted in one day races and for the stages during tours.

[Pokemon Club]

And during this time I lose 130k each day on Giro, we need a revolution !