Suggestions on the new version of RSF

Discussion about technical stuff and suggestions for improvement.

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cataracs
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Re: Suggestions on the new version of RSF

Post by cataracs » Fri Sep 29, 2023 12:02 am

Alkworld wrote:
Tue Sep 19, 2023 9:57 pm
We're planning something like that for November:
Current suggestion (details to be discussed):
- Background info: currently we have roughly 100 active teams in Divs 1-5, roughly 20 more in the lower divisions
- Teams in divisions 1-5: 16-18-20-22-24
- Relegated Teams in div 1-5: 3-4-5-6-7
- Div 6 will contain all the rest, 7 and 8 will be dropped (or merged with 6)
- inactive teams (0 points from previous two months and 0 races at month change) are directly put in Div 6 (also to limit farming a bit)
- auction size will be automatically adapted based on the size of div 1 to 5
- division sizes can be adapted every month, if player numbers drastically change
This honestly won't make anything "special" it basically just gets the inactive teams out of the way.

FL's suggestion (in some other thread probably) sounds a lot better to me. World tour division with 21 teams, Proteam division with 18 teams and then the rest in the continental division. Then put the 0 races team in some random division...

For the market give the new teams a one month period using the current div6 market (if they actually need this?) Because on another topic, the div6 market is not really useful in my opinion other than for farming good classics. Any new team would get a better team in the actual market with the reduced buyings, new teams don't need youth riders.

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Re: Suggestions on the new version of RSF

Post by Alkworld » Fri Sep 29, 2023 7:26 am

cataracs wrote:
Fri Sep 29, 2023 12:02 am
Alkworld wrote:
Tue Sep 19, 2023 9:57 pm
We're planning something like that for November:
Current suggestion (details to be discussed):
- Background info: currently we have roughly 100 active teams in Divs 1-5, roughly 20 more in the lower divisions
- Teams in divisions 1-5: 16-18-20-22-24
- Relegated Teams in div 1-5: 3-4-5-6-7
- Div 6 will contain all the rest, 7 and 8 will be dropped (or merged with 6)
- inactive teams (0 points from previous two months and 0 races at month change) are directly put in Div 6 (also to limit farming a bit)
- auction size will be automatically adapted based on the size of div 1 to 5
- division sizes can be adapted every month, if player numbers drastically change
This honestly won't make anything "special" it basically just gets the inactive teams out of the way.

FL's suggestion (in some other thread probably) sounds a lot better to me. World tour division with 21 teams, Proteam division with 18 teams and then the rest in the continental division. Then put the 0 races team in some random division...

For the market give the new teams a one month period using the current div6 market (if they actually need this?) Because on another topic, the div6 market is not really useful in my opinion other than for farming good classics. Any new team would get a better team in the actual market with the reduced buyings, new teams don't need youth riders.
What I wrote is not contradicting that. Division sizes can be changed monthly, even the number of divisions can be changed (but need to check more code to see, if the number of divisions matters somewhere else). However, I first want to see that division resizing work practically (bug-free), so first only changing the sizes. You can discuss here what the best sizes would be, how many teams should be promoted / relegated and who can use which transfermarket. I just need to know until end of October.

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Re: Suggestions on the new version of RSF

Post by cataracs » Fri Sep 29, 2023 3:18 pm

What's the point of this change? If it's getting rid of the inactive teams from Div1-5 then it works fine, but if it's making the upper divisions more interesting then it won't really work.

What will be interesting about "the upper divisions" if we're trying to put the 100 active teams in div1-5. And what's the point of the lower divisions market if everybody is in the upper divisions market?

And how is your problem with reset linked to divisions @RKL?

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Re: Suggestions on the new version of RSF

Post by Robyklebt » Fri Sep 29, 2023 3:58 pm

Reset should only be possible in D6+
I assume that will be the case.
I had understood in another thread probably that inactive teams would go down to D6 immediately after 1 month no races and 2 months no points, so max 2 months. That would have been a shortcut to reset. But seems I misunderstood and it's a 1 time deal? (If not, then my opposition to this shortcut stays)

So basically at this point no problem with reset anymore for me.

Question wasn't to me:
But point to this change clearly is to have active teams in the upper divisions, not like now where only D1 +2 are fully active. By having old teams hang around forever in D3-5, when they come back and they didn't sell their riders before leaving, they'll need a reset. Which would mean keep the reset up higher than it should be, right now still possible in D3 I think, could be made to D4+ already probably. Or D6, but then the admins have to give out hand-resets at times.

Other reason is that it's simply not competetive right now. Yes, Divisions mean nothing, but it's still nice to fight to get to the top division, right now you go up to D2 automatically, just make 1 point per month and there you are.
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Re: Suggestions on the new version of RSF

Post by Gipfelstuermer » Fri Sep 29, 2023 4:07 pm

Another reason is that finances, points and divisions are somewhat buggy since years (divisions not as buggy as finances but for example one division has 1 team too little) and they are all related to each other, so makes sense to clean up all of that. So a lot of the work is just updating the code, so that it has a good data structure.

If we want something 'special', is it just giving new names and sizes (like the WorldTour, ProTour, Continental Tour idea)? That is possible relatively easily then.

Or is it more than that? Should the divisions mean anything else? Then it's a different story and we are happy about suggestions and a discussion.
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Re: Suggestions on the new version of RSF

Post by cataracs » Fri Sep 29, 2023 4:15 pm

I'm just trying to understand a little more before making anymore suggestions.

Can I hear your opinions about the market please:

Is the div6 market going to be useful if most of the active teams are in div 1-5?

How better is the div1-5 market compared to the div6 market?

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Re: Suggestions on the new version of RSF

Post by flockmastoR » Fri Sep 29, 2023 5:04 pm

cataracs wrote:
Fri Sep 29, 2023 4:15 pm
I'm just trying to understand a little more before making anymore suggestions.

Can I hear your opinions about the market please:

Is the div6 market going to be useful if most of the active teams are in div 1-5?

How better is the div1-5 market compared to the div6 market?
Well, in fact that would be a reason to touch the divisional size (adapt to number of active teams). IMO the new teams, restarters (to a minor degree) should hang around there for some time. In fact the Div 6+ market was also always meant to "protect" the newcomers, give them quite good riders (not in terms of classics) + the in Division sold riders.
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Re: Suggestions on the new version of RSF

Post by Robyklebt » Fri Sep 29, 2023 5:26 pm

For a detailed analyses of the 2 markets I'd like to recommend you speak to Dr. T. FL, our resident specialist in things concerning the D6+ market, especially youth riders. If he's around I'm sure he can give us an update (or since nothing changed more like a rehash), although probably better in another thread.

For size ideas btw good moment for us non-admins to study the issue, end of month, we can see how many teams rode races this month!

29-38-16-4-7-6 in D1-6 (mistakes possible as usual) Some of them with 1 race, some of them probably won't re-race...
That's exactly 100? An additional 10 in D7

So the Alk proposal looks ok, would be exactly 100 teams.
But would be helpful to know how many there were in August, July etc.

Monthly changes: I'd be more for a "semi permanent" solution in the medium term. Meaning changing every month, sounds complicated, but maybe review it every 3-6month and adapt then. If we have 120 regularly active teams in March, updating it would be nice.

Ah, one more thing, why the pyramid? For me equal number everywhere would be ok too (would have been from the start of the div system, but Buhsossies liked the pyramid I think. Not that important, just asking.

And write down somewhere how the divisions are now, so that when in 13 years when it's all filled up, we can just create a 7th elite division or something. Instead of expanding the divisions forever.

BUT, 1st of November... go straight to 16-18-20-22-24 sounds a bit harsh, so you finish 10th in D2, normally go up to D1, but now you end up in D3? Can we make it a 2 step change, especially at the top, since the top 2 divisions right now are competitive. Something like 24-26-whatever in month 1, 10 down 4 up in D1, he next month then 10 down 2 up? To reach those 16 only at the first of Dec. Anyway, you know what I mean, a soft reform. But if it's the hard one that's ok too.

Don't name anything World Tour etc, if anything Alk-Tour, Donkey-Tour, named after the leaders of the eternal points classification!!! Ok, deal, no name works fine.
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Re: Suggestions on the new version of RSF

Post by flockmastoR » Fri Sep 29, 2023 7:26 pm

Against the rename for sure. Its the fight for the Division 1 title.
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Re: Suggestions on the new version of RSF

Post by cataracs » Fri Sep 29, 2023 8:57 pm

Names don't really matter anyway.
Imo Div1 20teams 5 relegated
Div2 20teams 5up 5down
Div3 60 teams 5up 5down
Div4 the rest+ new teams, 5up
Rest of divisions not really needed.

Upper divisions market for 1-2
Lower divisions market for 3-4

This will make the upper divisions have more importance.
Will the top teams get stronger and the weak teams remain weak? Not really since it's mostly a matter of trainings.

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Re: Suggestions on the new version of RSF

Post by flockmastoR » Wed Oct 04, 2023 3:33 pm

I know this is a problem just for a little minority of the managers.

But can we add a filter criteria for Buyable "all | HigherDiv | LowerDiv". I just got 20 riders and cannot meaningful filter for riders that I can buy when I sell a rider.
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Re: Suggestions on the new version of RSF

Post by Quick » Wed Oct 04, 2023 4:11 pm

flockmastoR wrote:
Wed Oct 04, 2023 3:33 pm
I know this is a problem just for a little minority of the managers.

But can we add a filter criteria for Buyable "all | HigherDiv | LowerDiv". I just got 20 riders and cannot meaningful filter for riders that I can buy when I sell a rider.
You kinda can - "auctions" is for Div 1-5. But I think that stops, once the rider reached 95% and goes lower into restricted area. Good enough to keep a hold of the TM though
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Re: Suggestions on the new version of RSF

Post by Robyklebt » Fri Oct 20, 2023 6:26 pm

The icons on top.

Make it 2 rows again like it used to be in flash. Instead of "hiding" the forum, the editor etc. There's a reason it was 2 rows in flash!
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Re: Suggestions on the new version of RSF

Post by Quick » Wed Nov 08, 2023 12:37 am

The New points/price money tab after the race would look nicer with salary being displayed in red.
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Re: Suggestions on the new version of RSF

Post by flockmastoR » Tue Dec 19, 2023 6:20 pm

Statistics->Riders

The riders are sorted by "Points" that implies that at least the riders with the most current points are listed there (they are not). What is the actual criteria which 200 riders are listed here? Looks like young guys need to wait to be listed here.
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Re: Suggestions on the new version of RSF

Post by Hansa » Tue Dec 19, 2023 11:52 pm

flockmastoR wrote:
Tue Dec 19, 2023 6:20 pm
Statistics->Riders

The riders are sorted by "Points" that implies that at least the riders with the most current points are listed there (they are not). What is the actual criteria which 200 riders are listed here? Looks like young guys need to wait to be listed here.
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Re: Suggestions on the new version of RSF

Post by lennylenny » Thu Dec 21, 2023 9:43 am

would be nice to have saveable transfermarket filters/customizeable filter templates
so for example someone could have a filter of youth rider only, with 55+ mountain, 73+ flat and 70+ downhill they could configure a template to that and then just need to activate the template so all those filter criteria are applied automatically

would save quite some clicks if you have specific threshholds you always look for
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Re: Suggestions on the new version of RSF

Post by Robyklebt » Thu Dec 21, 2023 11:38 am

Sorting your bids by chronological order and nothing else.
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Re: Suggestions on the new version of RSF

Post by flockmastoR » Thu Dec 21, 2023 12:02 pm

lennylenny wrote:
Thu Dec 21, 2023 9:43 am
would be nice to have saveable transfermarket filters/customizeable filter templates
so for example someone could have a filter of youth rider only, with 55+ mountain, 73+ flat and 70+ downhill they could configure a template to that and then just need to activate the template so all those filter criteria are applied automatically

would save quite some clicks if you have specific threshholds you always look for
Sounds like a nice future pro feature :D
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Re: Suggestions on the new version of RSF

Post by Quick » Wed Dec 27, 2023 11:28 am

Is the page gone, where you could see individual training results of each rider?

Only find the overall graph(imo not looking good, could do without that) and the overall thing but miss where I see when they took which trainings.
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Re: Suggestions on the new version of RSF

Post by Bear » Wed Dec 27, 2023 12:26 pm

Just check development. I think it's fine to check when the rider trained or not.

For stats... would it be possible to have the best 1000 riders when you sort for mountain skill for example? I always miss some riders when it's just sorted for the best total 1000 riders in points.

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Re: Suggestions on the new version of RSF

Post by Quick » Wed Dec 27, 2023 12:32 pm

Bear wrote:
Wed Dec 27, 2023 12:26 pm
Just check development. I think it's fine to check when the rider trained or not.
Not an option to really consider on mobile. Maybe it's better on Desktop, idk.
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Re: Suggestions on the new version of RSF

Post by Bear » Wed Dec 27, 2023 3:10 pm

I "bearly" use the mobile version. I dont know about that. But desktop is ok imo.

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Re: Suggestions on the new version of RSF

Post by Robyklebt » Tue Jan 09, 2024 3:54 pm

Alkworld wrote:
Mon Jan 16, 2023 3:50 pm
Gipfelstuermer wrote:
Mon Jan 16, 2023 2:41 pm
Quick wrote:
Mon Jan 16, 2023 1:36 pm
Thanks to version 1.11.0 alphabetical sorting is back. Praise the overlords! Now if we could do this sorting by last name instead of first name, that would be perfect.
We had it solved before tbh, but then we introduced those standardized tables (which allows quick creation of tables with filtering), but here a name is first name + last name, so sorting defaults to first name. Maybe Alkworld has a solution.
it's possible, just not done yet
Thought I would write a reminder for the 1 year anniversary, but I'm a week early, almost to the minute!

Last name sorting please!
And in the transfer place, "own bids", just chronological. There sorting by name, first or last really is pointless. I know that's not a wanted sorting, just something that probably happened automatically for internal reasons, but having it there is not only pointless, but even annoying.
Yes, I could just delete my bids, but started doing that once a year, in January a few years ago... why not. And know that Alk used not to delete his bids either, or not often (old flash you only saw the non-deleted bids, so after a while you only saw your and Alk's bid) There chronological please! Some extra work, but extra pleasure too once it's implemented.

For the rest: Sort by last name! It's possible, just not done yet=Let's do it! (Let's as in Alk or Gipfel...)
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Re: Suggestions on the new version of RSF

Post by Bear » Tue Jan 09, 2024 10:29 pm

I also prefer sorting by last name.

And I like the feature that we can "follow" riders on the market. But if nobody buys the rider, you cant see the skills anymore. Would be nice to change that. Otherwise I need to do my 3735679 and 3567479 bids again...

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