Tranfermarket revisions: Youth rule +15%

[Robyklebt]

Right now riders that are 24 or younger get 15% more when sold.


Why was the rule implemented? So that teams are not stuck with their riders if they don't train well, they can sell them without losing too much money. It was introduced shortly after the introduction of the "tax system" The tax system which hurt big teams, so the "Fritz Otz rule" was there to soften the impact a bit, not buy a rider, be stuck with him forever if you are a rich team. Of course rich team still make minus if they sell a 24 year old, but not as much as if it would be without the 15%. So it works. Where it doesn't work is: new teams. Instead of 80 percent they get 90% etc. Or not active teams that want to make some money while not riding. See JPS classics right now. Or Skulker whatever his team is called now. For more example ask Franconia, he seems to know more teams.

Is that good? Don't think so. And it's not what the rule was made for. What makes it really bad is: Now JPS takes away riders that will never ride in his team from active managers. Just to make money of them.

So change the +15% rule for riders 24 or younger. Don't make it 15% for everybody, but make it up to 60%. If you get more than 60% (tax 40 or less) you don't get extra youth money. So a team with a tax rate of 70% will still get the 15% more, he get's 45% instead of 30 for his young rider. A team with 60% tax still get's 15% more, 55 instead of 40. But a team with a tax rate of 55 will only get 5% extra. With that he probably often still makes a small benefit or just not too much. But the teams that don't need it, since they DON'T lose money anyway by selling a 24 year old don't get that 15% anymore.

That won't stop action like that of JPS right now, but it will make it less effective. But most importantly it will give those 15% only to the ones that it was originally thought for, the big teams with a big tax rate.

[Robyklebt]

Ah, yeah, already know that we'll have 50 managers complaining about "rich teams" that get all the advantages. Won't have the energy to explain the obvious to non-thinking people, so if the mob convinces Buhmann not to change that (ok, usually he doesn't need convincing not to do something ) then go to plan b and just cut the 15% rule. It's a good rule for big teams with no flexibility, but it's abused so often that I'd rather see RSF without it than in it's present form.

[Buhmann]

Maybe you are right...

And i think we shouldn´t have this fix value 15%. Instead we sould use a dynamic System. 21 years old: +25%, 22: 20%, 23: 15%, 24: 10%
Somethink like this.

[Cerro Torre RT]

As Roby explained, the total cut seems the most promising proposal for me. As big teams, that don't have flexibility on the market, have got that (hopefully) within their teams, it does not seem nessessary for them, too. I think those young riders got enough benefits so most teams will remain buying them. A risc of failure seems just to be ok, comparing their prices to older ones that got an equal good perspective. For all teams.

[Robyklebt]

Well?

[team fl]

In general, I like this idea. But if implemented, the cut when you still get the 15 % or not has to be set carefully. I would rather suggest, that there is some sort of fluent transition and not a clear cut like manager a with taxes up to 60 % gets + 15 % and manager b with taxes up to 59 % gets nothing.

I like also cerros thoughts about a dynamic system. maybe those two ideas can be put together to a helpful one

[Buhmann]

Yes, a dynamic system would be much better. Same tax for rich teams and very very rich teams for young riders is not ideal.

[Zauberlehrling]

Just reduce the tax by 1/3 or something like that for a young rider.

Team A, Newbie has the minimum Tax of 10%. He doesen't get more for a young rider.
Team B, middle-rich, has a Tax of 25%, 15% over the minimum. The Tax reduces 5% for a young rider, it is now 20%.
Team C, rich, has a Tax of 50%, it reduces 13.33333% (-10, then /3), it is 36.666666% now.
Team D, really rich, Tax is 70%, it would reduce 20%, new Tax 50%.

Poor teams get an advantage not really remarkable, for big teams it's a big benefit. The "normal" active Team in RSF is probably Team C, there it doesen't change a lot.

[olmania]

Team D, really rich, Tax is 70%, it would reduce 20%, new Tax 50%.

Oh please YES !
I love you ZL !

[Buhmann]

Oh, behave!

But you know that ZL only meant the young riders? Are the 5% so important more for you?

[Robyklebt]

My idea still the best

a) Tax under 40%=no extra 15%. Tax 41-55%=Get 1%-15% extra. Tax over 55% Get 15%
b) eliminate the rule completely

This seriously isn't even an issue that has to be discussed a long time. Leave it as it is (not perfect) change it, cut it. Takes little time too probably.

[Zauberlehrling]

b) okay
a) Problem: A team with 40% Tax gets the same amount as a team with 55%, even if the second team is much richer...

[Buhmann]

b) is good...maybe decrease instead the tax for rich teams a little. So that all in all the money is the same but without this rule.

In the past we needed rules to make buying youth riders more attractiv. But now? Maybe buying old, good known riders should be more interest. So that i think delete this rule wouldn´t be such a problem.

[Robyklebt]

Mmh, ok, see the problem with a)... then just simply go with b) as Buhmann says... (although I see no reason to decrease the tax in general)

[Buhmann]

Any disadvangtes? Integrate it now, Announce it, so that i can implement it in a few weeks?

[Zauberlehrling]

Why announce?? Just do it now. It's not a big changement and can be done immediately.

[Robyklebt]

Hello? Don't remember anybody complaining about just killing the +15% youth rule. Has been mentioned in other threads too, in German as well, don't remember arguments against it. Buhmann seemed to be for it. It's been lying around for ages without opposition? HOw about doing it? Unless now somebody has a good reason why not too?

Plus, wrong thread, but how about implementing the 50 days rule for youth riders too?

[Buhmann]

For youth riders, there is allready another rule: You can sell them only, if they are really in your team. Means: Sometime you have to wait one month. Is it not enough? Okay, better would be: 50 day ruel for youth riders, too. But it should be possible to sell them, if there are not yet in the team.

[claw]

if they are sold - will they appear on the youth-transfermarket again?

[Robyklebt]

Ok, this is about the offtopic thing now, yes?

Why not just: You have to think before you buy a rider even if he's only 20 yet? You buy him the first of the month, you know you have to wait for 30 days to use him. By allowing to sell them again you just promote buying and selling, oh, ok, rider, but maybe I find a better one, bought, next refresh, uh, a bit better, sold, new one, then once again. Don't like that.
And like the other riders, you buy him, he has to stay 50 days before he can be sold, think before you buy him, like for other riders.

I would just do it like that, 50 days from the moment they are really in the team and like now, they can't be sold as youth riders. Be responsible for your actions.

Cut the 15% rule, to be on topic again.

[skull]

i complain
i like the 15%

[Cerro Torre RT]

yes, please cut it. An unnecessary benefit of i type of riders that are already the moste wanted.

[Luna]

Giving the youth riders the same 50 day rule as for any other rider would make buying and selling of them less attractive, too, even if they would be able to get sold while still 20 years old and 3 weeks away from actually arriving to the team.

[Robyklebt]

Shit... can Buhmann ignore you?

Bah... discuss it with Buhmann...

Oh, Cerro wrote something. Completely agree, good argument, discuss it with him!

[Buhmann]

Luna is right. (If i understood him correctly )
The same ruel for the youth riders. Selling is possible before they are really in the team, too.