The fake Tour, eh, post Giro criterium, real, eh, afternoon anyway 15h (likely)

Discuss about the RSF Races

Moderator: englishmods

schappy
Posts: 347
Joined: Mon Mar 29, 2010 11:10 pm
Contact:

Re: The fake Tour, eh, post Giro criterium, real, eh, afternoon anyway 15h (likely)

Post by schappy » Sat Jul 08, 2023 7:17 pm

I am so happy to ride in this Field. Thanks everyone for the first nice week.

Today a Big Donkey win, really big. Godd move, good riding, enought from the sprinters. Really good Job.
I´ve got the magic in me

Robyklebt
Posts: 10024
Joined: Thu Feb 11, 2010 6:50 pm
Contact:

Re: The fake Tour, eh, post Giro criterium, real, eh, afternoon anyway 15h (likely)

Post by Robyklebt » Sun Jul 09, 2023 5:34 pm

Next 5 days over, well 4, but since the rest day is the fifth, we count it as done as well.
Wasn't optimistic, won 2 stages. Rrurrambu first, Verkerk pulled by Rrurrambu after. Unexpected.

Stage 6 long range attack with Steiner, expected nobody in his wheel, Bruhn was there, although he took a few breaks.. but ok, once I go I had to ride. Would have continued even if he stopped completely. If we go red earlier... immediately when the downhill starts, maybe we get a lot closer to the win, but with Bruhn clearly stronger in the end, ok that we didn't for me. The success of the attack was always dependent on the reaction in the back, hoped with Steiner alone it would be almost non-existant, with Bruhn it still was slow, until at some point in the Tourmalet I think. So doesn't change much in the end, wasn't getting through alone either. Classic group caught us anyway, but ok, if Steiner-Bruhn look like they can do it I simply don't ride with Lekubarri and then the classic group isn't a danger anymore.

Stage 7, sprint, Meisen goes at 200, very early, sure to be overtaken by Rrurrambu on his wheel like that.. And he was, and it was the win. A bit ridiculous, but ok, Pommes with work stuff at the time it seems.
Stage 8, scared of the 6, for once Mobster managed to keep quiet, all together for the sprint, even Zalevski with his horrendous flat skill wasn't dropped on the final 2 5, Not sure how to sprint with FL being more off than on, having no train left, Park as strongest sprinter on a +2 I assumed, fuck it, let's have Rrurrambu work for Verkerk, went at 500, thanks to x things that went exacly right, from Pommes not going on me immediately, over Gipfel not getting there when he probably tried to Pommes being blocked when he started the sprint with Polters.

2 very lucky and somehow ridiculous wins, but have to admit I'm very happy with the second one, normally that won't work, did this time.

STage 9: Puy de Dôme, we have an open bill (englisch?) with that one. 1992, Big Donkey on his bike passes the Puy de Dôme with his cousin, but as we already knew actually, private road, forbidden to ride up for cyclists.
Attack with Vanuytsel Gurruwiwi planned, but since CC might want the sprint points and not let go.. .let's try with Henri-Ceroni first. Group goes... 5', then stable vs L in the back, 6 riders in front, but pullers already very weak.. So went with the original plan later, Gurruystel, the Salamanca and Schappy in front stopped tempo too, so caught up fast, Red Isidoor, always demanding better conditions for riders, bringing the gap up to almost 6', then pace in the back logically increased, down to a bit over 3' in Clermont-Ferrand, then. No chance, final climb, first part to the bottom of the real climb, Bruhn siebs, keeps everybody away with Hoang who had followed Gurruytsel, then attack by Kiipeilijä at 4 km from the end, Bruhn goes too, Steiner Oberdorf and Mabchado follow, Hill and Clévenot don't, they tried Kiipeilijä, great stage win for Kiipeilijä, Steiner gets second, Oberdorf third.

So low expectations, big results for the Donks this 4 (5!) days. 2 wins, was almost expecting 0 at this point.

GC of riders that count:

Oberdorf: But will lose time regularly from now on probably, form
Kiipeilijä 8" back: Bruhn could turn out to be very important later, to hold Hill back, wait for his attack riding with Bruhn, then chase with Hill. But not much of a team behind the 2 climbers
Hill 18" back. Form seems worse than Kiipeilijä right now, so considering all the mountains coming.. .I tend to see him as favorite. But right now seems clear that it will be between those 2.
Clévenot 1'08", but announced as a stage hunter. With his reg a lot would have to fit for him to become a GC win candidate, but why not, Hill has no super team either, FLs classic army is stronger. But with another focus too maybe. But a calm following performance with one big coup might be enough.
Steiner: 1'30" Classics there, tactical intelligence of the manager not necessarily, although today was good. 86 vs 88 not easy, see Clévenot finally, one big coup might be enough if for the rest he manages to stay in touch and not lose time. The short TT helps him, but that alone nowhere near enough, it's a small advantage to the others.
Sinisterra: 1'52" No chance, sorry ABC 83-51 no reg won't be enough, it's holding on and hoping to end up as high as possible
Bruhn: 86 mountain, helping Kiipeilijä, but following Steiner? Then a nice anchor there, taking Steiner out in case Kiipeilijä is in good position, getting Bruhn back in if Hill looks better.

Anyway, as I said, normally it's just between L and CC, I see CC with an advantage, but might be wrong and might change fast. Today 30" gained for L, so things can change fast. The others... Oberdorf with a good following in a flatter part? Clévenot as parasite with seconds here and there and one big gain? Steiner similarly? Bruhn on the coattails of Steiner? Don't really see it to be honest.
Kraftsystemrevision! Include the distance!
Basics reform: Give blue a chance!
Don't punish bugusers. We all have to use bugs, since most of them are declared as "features"!

Gipfelstuermer
Posts: 1532
Joined: Wed Jul 13, 2011 10:43 am
Location: Weltenbummler
Contact:

Re: The fake Tour, eh, post Giro criterium, real, eh, afternoon anyway 15h (likely)

Post by Gipfelstuermer » Wed Jul 12, 2023 11:48 am

10 Stages over. 7 out of 11 teams with a stage win so far.

2 - CircleCycle
2 - Schappy
2 - Big Donkey
1 - CreditPommes
1 - Team FL
1 - L RSV
1 - Gipfelstuermer

Of course happy with Pavlo's win from yesterday. CC was right: The team had to wait until stage 10. Is that bad? Compared with a team winning stage 1, yes. Compared with our own past, not too bad. We had worse: Giro 2022 we had to wait until stage 13. So winning stage 10 seems fine. In fact, winning 1 stage per Grand Tour has always been the target. Could be stage 21 and we'd still be happy.

Along the way, some other misconceptions about the Gipfelstuermer strategy so far during this tour. All the stuff I would not be doing:

- Not riding for wins: I keep saying I ride for cake. Don't take it literally. Just means I ride for fun. Some ride for money. I ride for fun. That involves pro active style when I have time for it. Sometimes working, or playing from mobile, comes in between, then more passive strategies are necessary. Why cake? It's the reward for a fun race! And it also makes the race more enjoyable if you have 10 quiet minutes with coffee & cake during the race! But winning is a target, too. As I said, 1 stage per Grand Tour is a nice target, not uncommon amongst participating teams.
- Not riding for the leader: Depends who's the leader! With an LBL winner and a Roubaix winner in the line up, of course I ride for them, too, not only for hill sprinter Mosconi. Even if Mosconi was the leader: we rode for him on stage 3, we had a perfect train, noone following, still couldn't win. So it would be strange to rely only on him, especially as we have other strong riders like Poulnikov and Medina in the team.
- Not cooperating: As Team FL preaches all the time: Communicate! If you are in a group and you would like to cooperate with the others: Write in the chat. Try to find a realistic agreement. Can be done and is often successful in escape. Otherwise it is full on racing in escape. Which is also OK and fair.
- Group killer: May be just a tactical move. Chase some other GC teams, blame it on the group killer Gipfel, then let Gipfel ride alone later, have GC under control. Could call it clever communication. So I'll continue to ride for groups. And I take group killer as a compliment if it means "have to take escapes with Gipfel seriously".
GIP MASTERPLAN
Gameplay: Flexible Min-Tact. Improve Sprint System. Windkante.
Marketing: Re-attract old players. Advertisement. Social Media.
New Players: Fair Start Budget, New Tutorial.
Fairplay: Improve FPC features, Fair Prize Money Disribution.

Gipfelstuermer
Posts: 1532
Joined: Wed Jul 13, 2011 10:43 am
Location: Weltenbummler
Contact:

Re: The fake Tour, eh, post Giro criterium, real, eh, afternoon anyway 15h (likely)

Post by Gipfelstuermer » Sun Jul 16, 2023 7:40 pm

15 stages over. 2nd restday tomorrow. 8 out of 11 teams with a stage win so far.

4 - CircleCycle
2 - Schappy
2 - Big Donkey
2 - CreditPommes
2 - Gipfelstuermer
1 - Team FL
1 - L RSV
1 - Cultural Salamanca

Today the dream scenario. After Roubaix winner Poulnikov won a stage, our LBL winner Medina scored another stage for the team. Both monument winners with a TDF stage win. And Medina did it on one of the most beautiful stages of this year's tour with Bluffy, Forclaz, Croix Fry and Aravis. Some of the most beautiful mountain passes that the team manager has ridden on! Poulnikov and Medina now both with the chance of reaching 5000 career points.

From the opponents, we expected a GC fight today but not much happened from our perspective. Time Trial and Col de la Loze will be decisive. If not decided by then, the stage in the Vosges can be a killer as well.
GIP MASTERPLAN
Gameplay: Flexible Min-Tact. Improve Sprint System. Windkante.
Marketing: Re-attract old players. Advertisement. Social Media.
New Players: Fair Start Budget, New Tutorial.
Fairplay: Improve FPC features, Fair Prize Money Disribution.

Robyklebt
Posts: 10024
Joined: Thu Feb 11, 2010 6:50 pm
Contact:

Re: The fake Tour, eh, post Giro criterium, real, eh, afternoon anyway 15h (likely)

Post by Robyklebt » Mon Jul 17, 2023 1:03 pm

Third week coming up, and to my own surprise I'm in the GC fight. For real! Yellow with 8" on Hill, 13" on Kiipeilijä. The 2 88 climbers, against my poor 86 Steiner.

But with the 22 km TT coming that advantage should extend a bit. Flat, same form, same luck I should gain 33" on Hill, 26-27" on Kiipeilijä. I never remember how mountain affects it exactly... but probably helps the 88 a bit over the 86. Downhill helps them for sure, so normally I should gain a bit less, but hope for over 20" on Hill for sure. So should have 30-40" advantage on both of them after tomorrow, then 2 mountain stages to defend that. Not easy. But will certainly try. Assuming Hill's form to be better than Kiipeiljä's I'd say Hill is still the overall favorite.

Oberdorf, form gone, for me is out of it. Clévenot low reg, not necessarily, although for the TT might hurt, but the 2 remaining mountain stages have 2 recovery days between them, so Clévenot could try to do what Steiner did on Saturday, not completely out.

Stages, of course I want to win another 3 sprints now, even if it might turn out to be only 2, well most likely only 2 sprints for Rrurrambu. Steiner, at this point it's all about the GC for him of course, stages not needed. Even if according to CC he's the favorite for tomorrow, the TT, let's hope CC is right. Still 10 km of the TT are black, 8 orange/red, 4 green, hm, maybe CC is right? Maierhofer downhill not too good either, in the red km I win, in the orange ones not sure.

Race report, not much to say, Tried the attack from far while having Ceroni in the first group, my 2 classics in the second, worked well, didn't really think it would. Actually I was more optimistic about the Cautarets attempt than this one here, but with L off, CC having to chase himself and not having a great team for Hill, if guys in front are people like Lekubarri and Trutat in the mountains. Only Fanha with no downhill and Delauney, with less mountain. Plus L offline, so had to a) do all alone and b) be weary of L when he comes online, both on some understanding possible, with one mostly off hard. But he defended very well.
Yesterday then gained time back, 10", good for me to only lose that, not starting fit and over 100 energy less when the attack came. And won time on Kiipeilijä too, which for the moment seems to be good for me. But not sure if it actually is? Good for Hill anyway.
Kraftsystemrevision! Include the distance!
Basics reform: Give blue a chance!
Don't punish bugusers. We all have to use bugs, since most of them are declared as "features"!

Robyklebt
Posts: 10024
Joined: Thu Feb 11, 2010 6:50 pm
Contact:

Re: The fake Tour, eh, post Giro criterium, real, eh, afternoon anyway 15h (likely)

Post by Robyklebt » Thu Jul 20, 2023 11:10 am

Big defeat for Steiner yesterday. Had only 10 energy advantage compared to Hill, hoped for more. Not the full 50 was clear, but never expected that Hill had managed to save 40 energy while losing only 19". But ok 88 mountain, so stronger in climbs, so losing less, more downhill losing less. Still, saving 40 and 19". Brrr. At least got the stage.

Then yesterday, Gronbech and Meyer followed, neither went, had to sacrifice Gurruwiwi early to catch Firpo and Micalizzi.

Definitely wanted to be in escapes, but CC too. L as well. Makes sense for all. With my 2 classics can possibly isolate the 2 other GC candidates. But CC with his 60-80 army can leave me with only Verkerk plus the classics quite easily too. 7-4 for him then. So I need people ahead too, to keep my classics freshish.

Early attack was an option, but no opening very early, later neither really, when I tried both Roti and Henry on me. Second time I ly Rotu... IMO a losing tactic, for him me ahead, presumably better form Hill the forced to react and hopefully weaken himself before attacking seemed more promising. But ok on me, so Hill who had changed to Rotu followed the second attack too. Then seemed clear I was going to lose yellow, just by how much?

A lot was the answer. A 6 just before 2 or 3 flattish km, Isidoor out, he was staying in tempo a bit ahead just in case... Immediately saw the danger. Fanha in tempo in peloton, double attack, unlikely I follow, tempo with Lekubarri. Yes/no/yes/no? Went for no. And CC went. 40" or something like that, over. Rotu still on me, but not sure he can follow either. A lucky and perfect sectrick here could have saved my day...And take following out. Then I probably keep yellow? But Hill gone, gained more time in the climb, Rotu unfortunately not riding for his yellow chances either, already concentrated on second place. Instead of fully cooperating trying to minimize Hill's time gain, taking breaks. Then gained 11" withe the attack. Riding and then gaining only 7" with the attack would have been faster...was going to drop Steiner anyway. 88 with more energy 30 at the start, plus 2 attacks vs 2 following .. yes it looked likely even before today's stage that neither Steiner nor Hill were going to ride for the win, that Hill was going to take that. But why not try, instead of fighting for second already now?
Hill anyway was gone, gaining time even after his attack, Kiipeilijä too up to 21", then Steiner was taken along by the Oberdorf classic group in the last km, was 3" ahead of them, no attack over, so 7" gained for Steiner. Well, self inflicted by Rotu, he rides with me takes me far enough away from them they won't catch and carry.

46" to Hill now. Lots and lots. Expected to lose it, but not by this much. Getting it back looks really hard, but let's see if we manage to come up with a working plan. One that doesn't include T-Mobile-A winning another stage!!!:)
Kraftsystemrevision! Include the distance!
Basics reform: Give blue a chance!
Don't punish bugusers. We all have to use bugs, since most of them are declared as "features"!

Robyklebt
Posts: 10024
Joined: Thu Feb 11, 2010 6:50 pm
Contact:

Re: The fake Tour, eh, post Giro criterium, real, eh, afternoon anyway 15h (likely)

Post by Robyklebt » Mon Jul 24, 2023 8:35 am

Final GC

01. 00:00:00 Henry Hill (CircleCycle)
02. 00:01:25 Urs Steiner (Big Donkey)
03. 00:02:00 Rotu Kiipeilijä (L RSV)
04. 00:02:59 Clément Clévenot (Team FL)
05. 00:03:01 Lena Oberdorf (Schappy)
06. 00:04:16 Héctor Mabchado (Cultural Salamanca)
07. 00:04:59 Marco Medina (Gipfelstuermer)
08. 00:05:03 Valborg Bruhn (L RSV)
09. 00:05:37 Luis Sinisterra (Team ABC-Polsat)
10. 00:07:29 Anastassija Merkuschyna (Schappy)

Pretty clear win by Hill finally, even if I had defended better on the Col de Loze stage, pretty safe to say Hill would have finished the job on the 20st stage.
For Steiner the GC got much harder the moment Hill trained to 88. The depressing thing about that of course is that Hill is 32 years old, which I hadn't even realized at the time. At 87 he could have been an ally trying to topple Kiipeilijä, at 88 he became favorite himself. L's team certainly not perfect for Rotu, Hill's team better. Yes, one classic with no downhill isn't all that, but a 60-80 army is worth a lot when it comes to helpers, with that he often will be able to cover lots of the mountain stages. Then up to 88...
L early form on which he didn't capitalize then of made Hill the outright favorite pretty soon really Steiner with 86 realistically was expected to end anywhere between 2nd and 4th, finally second, so in the end I'm satisfied. After gaining yellow Steiner was never let go again, covered by Hill at times, and by Rotu at all times it seemed, which makes sense for Rotu, since he couldn't count on following Hill either. For me would have been better if Kiipeiljiä tried himself at some point, he never did, so in the end we finished as we did. Good for my second place and for the mountain jersey, which became a goal after the failed Pyrenees attack.
Both Hill and me for my second place benefited from FL being off, while weak on reg, a full time on FL certainly could have tried some action with Clément early on, yes, then under reg, but depending on which day, that's not too bad, lose some time in the final. L as I said needed to win time early, then defend, having Bruhn in form late, in theory that actually looks good, problem was not winning time with Rotu early.

In GC nobody else could realistically expect to play a role, nobody did finally. Some more climbers would have been nice.
Anyway, Steiner showed that he can be a decent leader, no need for Payot!

Sprints. Frits winless, that's the big surprise of the Tour really. Usually FL wins GT sprint stages. 3 times second this time. The Donkey of course very happy with 2 wins, one for Rrurrambu and one the next day for Verkerk. With a cleverer manager who makes a train, after 2 sprinters were dropped by not fighting, Meisen was offline, Rrurrambu probably had excellent chances for another stage win last Friday, but his manager fucked that up beautifully. Doesn't matter, I'll take the 2 sprint wins I got.
Kraftsystemrevision! Include the distance!
Basics reform: Give blue a chance!
Don't punish bugusers. We all have to use bugs, since most of them are declared as "features"!

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 6 guests