Humuhumunukunukuapuaa Tour 15h

Discuss about the RSF Races

Moderator: englishmods

Robyklebt
Posts: 10021
Joined: Thu Feb 11, 2010 6:50 pm
Contact:

Re: Humuhumunukunukuapuaa Tour 15h

Post by Robyklebt » Sun Dec 13, 2020 5:36 pm

ARgh, another day, another failure.... Eiffel loses minutes, hours, days! Everything looked in place for a rather successful stage, but... anyway, no long report today, but Apicella + Eiffel -, our leader now is Michele!
Kraftsystemrevision! Include the distance!
Basics reform: Give blue a chance!
Don't punish bugusers. We all have to use bugs, since most of them are declared as "features"!

Team-Phoenix
Posts: 14
Joined: Fri Jul 30, 2010 8:56 pm
Contact:

Re: Humuhumunukunukuapuaa Tour 15h

Post by Team-Phoenix » Sun Dec 13, 2020 7:18 pm

Stage 6

The first hillsprint stage, because of the two dead riders from Stage 5 (Pana+Sarde) Eitan was never considerd. Plan A instead was bringing Andrzej into the hillsprinter group and go for a sprint there. Nghe almost brought him back (only 1 sec was missing), but couldnt quite do it. So we decided to not go for the srpint anymore and attack with Jamiro, who managed to win the stage with an attack on the final 3!

Stage 7

Quite a scary stage because of Eiffel probably being able to follow the big stagefavo Brandt in the end. In the start we have to catch Faye from Big Donkey hard, obviously dont want to get him in a group. Then Gipfel controls the stage, on the final hill Apicella attacks early, Ljuben and Biboul counter the attack the next km. A small group was following Biboul, Eiffel tried to follow Ljuben, but wasnt strong enough. We decide to catch Apicella with Ljuben and sit back with Ewodo in the chasing group. After Ljuben catches Apicella we decide to ride with Ljuben and Biboul together against Eiffel. It works, we gain around a minute on Eiffel and 4 bonusseconds on Apicella.


After the restday we cant be there for Stage 8, normally a good opportunity for Eithan, who lost green today and probably wont have a chance against Celestino and Boulanger for it in the end. If we dont find a sitter we just hope nothing crazy happens to the GK, maybe the other sprinters can make use of Eitans absence.

Gipfelstuermer
Posts: 1528
Joined: Wed Jul 13, 2011 10:43 am
Location: Weltenbummler
Contact:

Re: Humuhumunukunukuapuaa Tour 15h

Post by Gipfelstuermer » Sun Dec 13, 2020 11:33 pm

Stage 7, last stage before the restday, with an interesting uphill finish to Weimea Canyon. Plan was to control until the mountain, hope for a strong sieb, have Brandt as the strongest classic in front and let him attack on the flat-ish sections of the climb.

First 35km or so didn't even have to control as the fight for red was ongoing and Phoenix made sure the Donkey doesn't get anyone in escape. Then had to control on my own. Phoenix and Donkey didnt help despite good stage chances, but ok, on the day before restday I don't mind. So controlled on my own.

Then the climb. I thought, ok, Phoenix will control for GC and Donkey will control for Eiffel's Chance to follow a classic attack (potentially Brandt). But no.... Apicella attacks immediately. Then both Schiwkow and his classic helper Ewodo attack. I have Kapusta and Brandt in Ewodos wheel. But DeWit is nowhere as he followed Eiffel who was unable to follow Schiwkow. So I thought, damn, what now? Let Kapusta ride for Brandt. Let DeWit follow Eiffel. Worked good as Schiwkow caught Apicella and then they neutralized each other. Then, luckily an Apicella sieb on a +7, followed by a Brandt attack on a +2. Solo win from there for Brandt. Beautiful for him. He's a guy for the big races. One tour stage, one Vuelta stage, one Humuhumunukunukuapuaa stage. If Eiffel is there, might be able to follow....

...Like this, GC seems nearly save for Schiwkow. P2, P3 Donkey. P4, P5, P6 our team. Gaps are significant. What to do in week 2? Normal thing would be to go for stage wins and maybe green? Or is there a way to attack GC again? Depends how Phoenix will ride. If he's the nice GC leader who helps control or the aggressor who doesn't help control and attacks on last 10km.

Statistics:

Stage wins:
2 - Ljuben Schiwkow (Team-Phoenix)
1 - Andrea Siegemund (Girl Power)
1 - Eitan Hershko (Team-Phoenix)
1 - Jäger-LeCultre
1 - Boas Bergsteinsson (Gipfelstuermer)
1 - Jamiro Coelho (Team-Phoenix)
1 - Bartholomäus Brandt (Gipfelstuermer)

Stage wins by teams:
4 - Team-Phoenix
2 - Gipfelstuermer
1 - Girl Power
1 - Jäger-LeCultre

Stages in leader jersey:
4 - Ljuben Schiwkow (Team-Phoenix)
2 - Tim Eiffel (Big Donkey)
1 - Andrea Siegemund (Girl Power)
1 - Theodor Tomaselli (Jäger-LeCultre)

Stages in leader jersey by teams:
4 - Team-Phoenix
2 - Big Donkey
1 - Girl Power
1 - Jäger-LeCultre
GIP MASTERPLAN
Gameplay: Flexible Min-Tact. Improve Sprint System. Windkante.
Marketing: Re-attract old players. Advertisement. Social Media.
New Players: Fair Start Budget, New Tutorial.
Fairplay: Improve FPC features, Fair Prize Money Disribution.

Robyklebt
Posts: 10021
Joined: Thu Feb 11, 2010 6:50 pm
Contact:

Re: Humuhumunukunukuapuaa Tour 15h

Post by Robyklebt » Tue Dec 15, 2020 7:57 am

Far from brilliant my stage 7 :cry:

In retrospect my third biggest mistake of the tour.
No 1 being not going for Apicella, stupid Eiffel-fixation. Or actually more Eiffel but keep Apicella in, should have gone for Apicella leader, keep Eiffel in as good as I can.
No 2 being Habib and not Totakhyl. Ok, maybe that's further down, but Habib after the TTT where he was fighting to hang on forever and then when dropped continued giving all for another km, was basically unusable for the 2 important stages. And now with downtraining he's behind the Phoenix classic. Of course Totakhyl has even less reg, but with more TT he would have stayed fit, and there was no danger of downtraining.

Those 2 worse, stage 4 where I lost the minute though was better than this...
Riding in peloton to control for my minimal chances for the stage? Crazy? That's like expecting Gipfel to ride 100 km today for Boulanger. No no, was clear, attack with Faye. Just to make Phoenix ride a bit. Follow one of the 3 GPM guys, girl has only shit flat riders, caught in 2 km, so no. T-Mobster, the poor guy rode so much for finally nothing the day before, didn't want to block him (even if I thought it wouldn't matter, they would all 3 go immediately) so AAD it was. Unfortunately he went too late, so no Faye in front. Not that he was going to do much from the front, he started still way under reg, had 778 on the rest day finally.

Final climb, attack by Apicella early logic and good. Get as much time on the classics as fast as possible. In the flat they will catch me still, but at least let them ride for it. Well Gipfel I mean. And let's see how Phoenix reacts. How much time does he give Apicella, and with whom does he ride after. He went the km after, Eiffel on Schiwkow.. probably from the previous km, the 5, safety there. The plan was to change to a Gipfel later, but more DeWit than Kapusta. And not Brandt yet. Anyway, Ewodo went, 2 Gipfels following Eiffel out. Schiwkow got Apicella, rode one more km, then stopped, the group behind came back, Ewodo took over, in the back Eiffel couldn't catch that group. So... I even took a km out completely, give Apicella more space to DeWit, because the difference to Schiwkow at this point didn't matter anymore, around 40" back... or 1'10", basically the same, I need a big win, which seems unlikely. So give Apicella some space from DeWit... if DeWit wanted to be closer he could have ridden at this point, he didn't so let's both lose some time.

Anyway, the big mistake was: a) not putting Eiffel of Schiwkow and on Brandt. Or if not at least do some green safety tempo when only Ewodo was in tempo. I didn't expect the Schiwkow-Ewodo attack really, actually in 7 out of 10 cases I think that attack would have been an own goal, not this time. But should have expected that attack anyway. This in theory was maybe the stage where most was possible for me, time gain..and of course I didn't need just 9", last mountain stage Schiwkow wins time again automatically almost. But turned out a big defeat.

Today, sprint.. .if Phoenix has no sitter, we won't have a sprint, makes no sense for me to ride the whole stage vs attackers that in the end might beat me in the sprint anyway. With Phoenix it's easier, he has a train which I'm almost obliged to follow, then depending on when he goes and when I go it's normally place 1 or 2 for me, unless I fuck it up like on stage 1... with no Phoenix, no guy with a train that isn't sure to lose against me if I'm on his wheel.. I follow one, the other train wins, I go early the guy in my wheel wins. No, forget it, no Phoenix no sprint, most likely.

We won't have GC attacks either though I think... I will control that for Phoenix a bit, offline one day, no need to profit from it on a flat stage. Anyway, as the nominally best sprinter I will see a bit who I let go and who not, but don't plan to actually ride for a sprint.
Kraftsystemrevision! Include the distance!
Basics reform: Give blue a chance!
Don't punish bugusers. We all have to use bugs, since most of them are declared as "features"!

Weezel
Posts: 251
Joined: Sun Feb 28, 2010 1:26 am
Contact:

Re: Humuhumunukunukuapuaa Tour 15h

Post by Weezel » Tue Dec 15, 2020 12:42 pm

First week was okay, at least we have the mountain-jersey and chances for sprint.
Today we won't help much for a sprint with our 79-guy. Maybe even better, if a group comes through at one of the last stages for normal sprinters...
Manager von T-Mobile-A

Gipfelstuermer
Posts: 1528
Joined: Wed Jul 13, 2011 10:43 am
Location: Weltenbummler
Contact:

Re: Humuhumunukunukuapuaa Tour 15h

Post by Gipfelstuermer » Wed Dec 16, 2020 6:15 pm

Stage 8 was supposed to be a boring, long flat stage, but Phoenix being offline changed a lot. I mean, GC leader and best sprinter offline on a long flat stage had to cause chaos... Not blaming Phoenix, it is OK if you are offline a day within a two-week tour for sure, especially if you tell everyone ahead and don't sprint, consequently. So we saw multiple attacks, but with everyone knowing Phoenix is offline, it quickly became a bit of ridiculous fight. Everyone in escape, except Confidential Era, who was a real gentleman and controlled a bit in peloton. A bit was enough because Big Donkey also helped, after Girl Power tried a GC attack with 4 riders attacking. Although a fairly large escape had up to 15 minutes advantage, the peloton got back and it was a sprint in the end. Messerli won the sprint with a nice 350m sprint.

But still, not the coolest win by the Donkey really. Have the best sprinter and best GC (after subtracting offline Phoenix), then going in escape, playing funny games there, then win from the mass sprint.... mmmmhhh... I think it's fine. Who wants to kill the team on 212km effectively controlling for their main opponent in GC? But still, not the best way to win a race. If he wins from escape, fine.... but from the mass sprint not the best. That's why I was hanging Vic on Swift to avoid such a style by the Donkey... still it worked for him as I needed Vic fit for stage 9! Actually in the end he didn't play a role in stage 9, but I thought he would :D

Stage 9 a 136km short, hillly stage with a +4% finish. What to do for my team? Ride for a Brandt-attack, ride for Boulanger-sprint or escape to put pressure on Phoenix? I had no idea, so I asked if somebody would help for a sprint. I thought, if T-Mob helps (for green) and Phoenix helps (for GC control), it could work. They said yes, and so that was really the best option. Of course winning with Brandt through an attack would have been fun, but much more difficult to achieve that here. Phoenix and T-Mob simply with the much, much stronger flat riders with decent mountain skill. I mean, Mercado 65-85! Insane! With their help, the Jäger escape had no chance of course and Brandt was also able to block the +4%. Very good cooperation between Phoenix, T-Mobile and me. Many thanks! They even managed to keep Messerli, Karatzoglu and Tscholl away from the first group, which didn't really bother me as I didn't view them as stage favos, but of course helps for green chances.

Then the sprint. My train vs. T-Mobile train. My train stronger, but so everyone on my wheel including that Trzetrzelewska guy from Phoenix. I didn't want to sprint too early to give Phoenix a 5th stage win. 4 stages is enough, my friend! :D But then Celestino from 200m, luckily I go with Brandt there, too, so then Boulanger from 100m was a safe thing. 3rd stage win for our team in our own tour! Bastien's 5th race win so far, although he was only a helper for Jacob JJ Jefferson at the beginning of his career. Stage wins at Le Tour, Vuelta and Humuhumunukunukuapuaa speak for themselves! Merci, Bastien!

What is the situation for green? Celestino 79, Boulanger 76. The two are probably the main contenders. Vallaster 65 can win it through escaping. Messerli 63 can win it if it's only one more mass sprint. Brandt 58 and Schiwkow 54, Heshko 45 with small chances, too? Probably not, but ok to mention them at least.

GC unchanged of course. Phoenix advantage seems too big for Donkey or me to try anything right now. Well, Donkey and I had fun on stage 3, so situation in GC is acceptable :D

Statistics:

Stage wins:
2 - Ljuben Schiwkow (Team-Phoenix)
1 - Andrea Siegemund (Girl Power)
1 - Eitan Hershko (Team-Phoenix)
1 - Jäger-LeCultre
1 - Boas Bergsteinsson (Gipfelstuermer)
1 - Jamiro Coelho (Team-Phoenix)
1 - Bartholomäus Brandt (Gipfelstuermer)
1 - Fabian Messerli (Big Donkey)
1 - Bastien Boulanger (Gipfelstuermer)

Stage wins by teams:
4 - Team-Phoenix
3 - Gipfelstuermer
1 - Girl Power
1 - Jäger-LeCultre
1 - Big Donkey

Stages in leader jersey:
6 - Ljuben Schiwkow (Team-Phoenix)
2 - Tim Eiffel (Big Donkey)
1 - Andrea Siegemund (Girl Power)
1 - Theodor Tomaselli (Jäger-LeCultre)

Stages in leader jersey by teams:
6 - Team-Phoenix
2 - Big Donkey
1 - Girl Power
1 - Jäger-LeCultre
GIP MASTERPLAN
Gameplay: Flexible Min-Tact. Improve Sprint System. Windkante.
Marketing: Re-attract old players. Advertisement. Social Media.
New Players: Fair Start Budget, New Tutorial.
Fairplay: Improve FPC features, Fair Prize Money Disribution.

Robyklebt
Posts: 10021
Joined: Thu Feb 11, 2010 6:50 pm
Contact:

Re: Humuhumunukunukuapuaa Tour 15h

Post by Robyklebt » Wed Dec 16, 2020 6:25 pm

Yesterday finally a Donkey win, lots of work for it.. .well, just not in the peloton... :D

No Phoenix, so.... unless others want to help, no chance whatsoever for a sprint, group goes, I chase alone behind, I just kill half my team and expose myself to attacks in the last 40km that I can't hold. Plus, even if it's a sprint, how do I sprint, who do I follow, while with my 87 of course I still have very good chances it's far from an easy win, wrong wheel, the guy in front of me sprints slow, since otherwise he can't beat me, others faster... No no, not killing my team to most likely not be able to hold it, and if still having big chances of not winning.

So, block km 1, then another one later, to see who tries to go, put Swift there and go. Escape for me too, probably one of the only days I can go, even if I'm further back in GC now, not sure if Phoenix wants me in escapes on hilly stages....So Swift goes, and he went to collaborate, not block the escape.
Escape didn't fully work, Gipfel at times was reluctant to use his puller, wanted him back in the peloton too, use him today, but didn't like Swift in front either it seems, complicated. So stop and go a bit, when Girl came with 4 riders, among them a strong sprinter came close, worked again a bit. Then an attack series by Bajramovic and we were only 3, Vandenbroucke decided not to follow further, the Jägers somehow weren't there, then go.

In the meantime in the back Confidential came on and started riding with 15' back.... The Donkey, to his credit, joined with Coderch too then, then out again when he didn't come in tempo anymore, wasn't interested in killing more riders for what still seemed a pointless exercise. After the attack in front went, then Jäger at some point dropped back and joined, riding for sprint too... and so our escape was caught just as they hit 0 energy 3 km from the end.

Sprint, after having no idea who to follow Gipfel gave me the right idea, my own train. Hadn't actually thought of that before, and while my train is slow and sucks, why not, take my train to be somewhere to the front, jump train later. Every other option seemed wrong, sometimes moral, sometimes sporting reasons. Big surprise, only 2 trains, Jäger for his 76 with everybody on his wheel, Donkey slow train with nobody... so just went at 350, and it worked. Wouldn't have most likely if Jäger immediately went with his second guy, try to take the wheel, wouldn't have managed, but would have stayed closer, then Tscholl and especially the guys on his wheel would have had excellent chances to catch me. Like this Fabian won... I hoped for Swift during the stage, but I'm not complaining...

Today:
Easy win for Boulanger, as half expected, the other likely scenario was a Brandt attack, which then the winner would be more open. But finally Boulanger as announced, Gipfel already announced that he planned to try to block the last 4, which if the right riders were there normally wouldn't be a problem. Right riders, basically the Phoenix no 2 sprinter, the guy with the difficult name. He was there, no danger from Ewodo then, McCulloch with only 76 flat not really such a danger anyway, plus was in the back.
Only Jäger tried today, in the back 4 teams rode it seems at some point, I was offline, Swift rode a bit, for Eiffel and Messerli. After Boulanger was announced of course I had to go full for Messerli again, otherwise would most likely have kept Messerli and one of the 2 flat guys fit, but Belhassen too... (in retrospect keeping him fit anyway probably good, last km attack attempt! But 71-78....) Last sieb, Apicella can't sieb the polish Phoenix, basically over there. If he had, the polish wonder loses some seconds more, we are that much closer, he probably comes back, since Gipfel and T-Mobile had interest in letting him back, basicaly guarantees the sprint, without him those Phoenix classics might be a danger... But we would have been a bit closer. But not enough anyway I think, came back to 7", in front mostly T-Mob and Phoenix riding, in the back we had very nice mass, but... this Mercado really is not a nice guy, too strong. Last km, Eiffel tried, but I was 92% sure it wouldn't work, but why not, nothing to lose really, in the sprint Eiffel could do reasonably well, the way it worked out probably 6th? But who cares, 10th ok too, turned out to be 14th then, but Apicella 8th, so I have my top 10. Sprint Boulanger the strongest, as could be expected, unless he does a big mistake there really was no way to lose this. Here Boulanger is like a 90 sprinter vs 80 in the flat, or 84...
For Phoenix actually riding for his sprinter IMO didn't really make that much sense, Messerli and Karatzoglou and Tscholl there puts his top 3 at risk, but increases his chances to win IMO. But ok, not huge.
For the stage win for T-Mobile A too, having the 3 others there really would open up chances for him, like this they weren't really that big, train vs train with the mountain skill Gipfel seems much stronger. Go on his wheel, and then... wait, Boulanger going at 100 is still a sure win, going at 150 a risk that is not hopeless. If Celestino goes at 150, with Brandt not having to go before 200.... he doesn't gain much. But with Messerli, Karatzoglou and Tscholl there... other train maybe (I would have redone my train from yesterday) and then maybe after all Boulanger is forced to go earlier...
But of course for T-Mobile green, (which IMO Boulanger will win anyway in the end), so having Messerli there made little sense for him, I wouldn't have waited for him either.

Anyway, tomorrow the same but different, definitely no chance for Messerli, if they are not too lazy another hill sprint, if Celestino is there with Boulanger, then that's his chance, most likely he will, while Brandt and the climbers could possibly bring Boulanger to the line before Celestino rejoins, the risk of running into attacks by Coelho-Faye-Belhassen-Ewodo is clearly too big... we'll see, I can imagine riding with Boulanger against Celestino, to show T-Mobile that waiting for Messerli woudl have been better :lol: (highly unlikely I do that, but seems like a nice idea now that I thought of it)
Kraftsystemrevision! Include the distance!
Basics reform: Give blue a chance!
Don't punish bugusers. We all have to use bugs, since most of them are declared as "features"!

Robyklebt
Posts: 10021
Joined: Thu Feb 11, 2010 6:50 pm
Contact:

Re: Humuhumunukunukuapuaa Tour 15h

Post by Robyklebt » Wed Dec 16, 2020 6:30 pm

Gipfelstuermer wrote:
Wed Dec 16, 2020 6:15 pm
Have the best sprinter and best GC (after subtracting offline Phoenix), then going in escape, playing funny games there, then win from the mass sprint.... mmmmhhh... I
Playing funny games? Swift rode completely normally, it was Jäger that kept attacking at first. You that kept not wanting to use Vic as puller. AAD that then did serial attacks. The only thing of not Swift did was chase down one attack by Jäger riding red with Swift for 2 km or so... funny games?
Kraftsystemrevision! Include the distance!
Basics reform: Give blue a chance!
Don't punish bugusers. We all have to use bugs, since most of them are declared as "features"!

Gipfelstuermer
Posts: 1528
Joined: Wed Jul 13, 2011 10:43 am
Location: Weltenbummler
Contact:

Re: Humuhumunukunukuapuaa Tour 15h

Post by Gipfelstuermer » Wed Dec 16, 2020 6:51 pm

Robyklebt wrote:
Wed Dec 16, 2020 6:30 pm
Playing funny games? Swift rode completely normally, it was Jäger that kept attacking at first. You that kept not wanting to use Vic as puller. AAD that then did serial attacks. The only thing of not Swift did was chase down one attack by Jäger riding red with Swift for 2 km or so... funny games?
Well, there was no need to use Vic as puller before Girl Power made the GC attack. Then I offered him once, nobody joined. I offered him again, we rode some 10-20km (?), I think then you started to ride in peloton. Even if that was to chase Girl, you didn't do that immediately, so it felt like you really want to destroy the escape, and I preferred to stop again. Then at some point that Jäger attack. No Swift, no Vic, all fine... I think then AAD was riding to destroy that, right, not you. But then another similar attack and Swift rode to destroy that escape. I think that was 4 riders incl. AAD, but again excluding Swift & Vic. Then later you have 3 riders in escape, excluding Jäger and me, suddenly you ride (although 3 rider, 150km or so to go did not look very promising. So "Funny games" maybe a bit exaggerated, but to me felt kind of like destroying the escape, even if not 100% intentional or planned like that, more like a thing you welcome if it happens somehow.

But really, I don't care too much about that stage 8. Was never favo for that or a stage I would target, so really all good with that strategy of yours. But of course easier to say so for me after winning stage 9 :)
GIP MASTERPLAN
Gameplay: Flexible Min-Tact. Improve Sprint System. Windkante.
Marketing: Re-attract old players. Advertisement. Social Media.
New Players: Fair Start Budget, New Tutorial.
Fairplay: Improve FPC features, Fair Prize Money Disribution.

Robyklebt
Posts: 10021
Joined: Thu Feb 11, 2010 6:50 pm
Contact:

Re: Humuhumunukunukuapuaa Tour 15h

Post by Robyklebt » Wed Dec 16, 2020 7:11 pm

I started chasing the girl GC attack immediately, when she attacked with 2, nothing, when the GC guy went, I chased. Even a km red with Trewlove... then changed to Coderch, until caught, then went out again.

In front? Jäger and you, all fine? For Jäger and you, clearly not for AAD, T-Mobile or me... that's not "destroying" the escape, that's riding for your chances. AAD had his leader in the back, of course he's going to ride with his puller. The attack itself was more "destructive" but made the race more interesting.
Same a few km later when then the AAD puller was ahead with you and the 2 Jäger. Of course I ride, let you go, not sure the escape then works with AAD having a puller who won't ride, but if I don't react fast, then it's too late possibly. Swift and T-Mob leader in the back, AAD leader, but has a guy in the front, you with by then clearly unfitter than the leaders Vic... if I do nothing let the group 2' my chance is gone, I will have to ride red for x km thus losing all chances vs the AAD leader, who normally won't cooperate, he has his puller in front who will try to suck there too. Vic will be at the same energy as Swift and Hofbauer. So I go in immediatly, catch the group fast, some energy loss, but still ok. Think T-Mob joined too actually, not sure anymore. Again, that's not destroying anything, that's absolutely normal riding for my chances.

Then riding when we were 3? Of course.... Actually I came back and went into tempo immediately, was probably pissing or getting something to drink, so missed the first attacks. Without I might have gone into tempo after the first. But might have not, becaue at this point Vic WAS a problem. Much more sprint, much less energy ( I suppose) makes it all very difficult to collaborate. Once he was gone, collaboration between 3 guys with very similar energy just made complete sense. Had your leader been there instead of Vic, even better....
And actually that's exactly the same as the 2 or so km red with Swift mentioned above. Riding for my chances. If I don't ride in either case my chances diminish.

Tempo in the back after Girl was caught, yes, Coderch joined Confidential after a while.. With the best sprinter I sort of felt compelled to. But I said in the chat as well that Swift was still my first option. Even if by then the group in front wasn't really working that well, but that had nothing to do with Swift. Once it was clear that the group in front was going (the 3 man group) at some point I took Coderch out again (partly because he didn't get into tempo anymore too of course)
Kraftsystemrevision! Include the distance!
Basics reform: Give blue a chance!
Don't punish bugusers. We all have to use bugs, since most of them are declared as "features"!

Robyklebt
Posts: 10021
Joined: Thu Feb 11, 2010 6:50 pm
Contact:

Re: Humuhumunukunukuapuaa Tour 15h

Post by Robyklebt » Wed Dec 16, 2020 7:18 pm

Ah and about today, Brandt-Eiffel fun you said in the fairness comment.

For me, but not for you.... of course for you Boulanger was the much much much better option. Brandt not only has Eiffel but also others in his wheel, McCulloch if he's there, Ewodo, if he's fit (he wasn't) Belhassen possibly. Coelho maybe too? Schiwkow, his flat is not THAT bad, 59, pretty good, so maybe enough (not sure, if he was my guy I wouldn't be that confident, but since he's a Phoenix I would fear he is there) DeWit, Ockers, Kapusta, hell I don't know. But pretty sure some guys would have followed. And then it's an open sprint, which I of course would have preferred over that sprint :D But for you clearly better to go for Boulanger were you were pretty clearly the favorite.
So next time try the attack, more fun for me!

Ah, and go do that winners interview....
Kraftsystemrevision! Include the distance!
Basics reform: Give blue a chance!
Don't punish bugusers. We all have to use bugs, since most of them are declared as "features"!

Weezel
Posts: 251
Joined: Sun Feb 28, 2010 1:26 am
Contact:

Re: Humuhumunukunukuapuaa Tour 15h

Post by Weezel » Thu Dec 17, 2020 11:55 am

I really like to end races at the podium, but it's obviously a little bit frustrating to see always celebrating other guys, when you do lots of work for it.
I think my problem is, that Gipfel can't really help after the sieb with his poor flat guys, so it's my job to keep the Sprinters like Messerli away. And in the end, I lack of power to win the sprint. Today there is another possible chance for a hill-sprint. Let's see, flat end is better for Celestino, but this fit Gipfelstürmer-Train is very strong. Maybe I just have to adjust my sprint-tactics...
Manager von T-Mobile-A

Robyklebt
Posts: 10021
Joined: Thu Feb 11, 2010 6:50 pm
Contact:

Re: Humuhumunukunukuapuaa Tour 15h

Post by Robyklebt » Thu Dec 17, 2020 12:44 pm

Or let Messerli back, then Celestino isn't frustrated. Losing against a superior sprinter is less annoying than losing against some Boulanger due :lol:

Too late for that though now, the 1,5 stages I could try are over.

Btw, last stage +3 sprint..... Boulanger-Celestino look good again, might change my sprint tactic too....
Kraftsystemrevision! Include the distance!
Basics reform: Give blue a chance!
Don't punish bugusers. We all have to use bugs, since most of them are declared as "features"!

Weezel
Posts: 251
Joined: Sun Feb 28, 2010 1:26 am
Contact:

Re: Humuhumunukunukuapuaa Tour 15h

Post by Weezel » Thu Dec 17, 2020 5:39 pm

Probably a big mistake to wait for Scinto, thought he is useful for the downhill km.
But it cost us the 9 seconds we didn't managed to get in the end. Third place in the sprint in the end, because AAD closed our door to beat Gipfelstürmer. We managed to keep green one more day, but tomorrow Gipfelstürmer will take over.

Because tomorrow there is no chance to come back for a hill-sprint. Sieb is steeper (+8/+7) and even more downhill in the end than today.

Funfact: Phoenix 4th place in the front, winner in the back. But I would probably have also tried it with Coelho instead of Trzetrzelewska (crazy name, had to look three times to do it right!)
Manager von T-Mobile-A

Robyklebt
Posts: 10021
Joined: Thu Feb 11, 2010 6:50 pm
Contact:

Re: Humuhumunukunukuapuaa Tour 15h

Post by Robyklebt » Thu Dec 17, 2020 6:21 pm

Argh... that was bad. Belhassen forgot to sprint... idiot Donkey. But ok, Kapusta seemed strong, so not easy for Belhassen either, but he was my normal leader today.

Rest: Planned to join the attack, but was busy, so no attack. Then thought I maybe could do some early sieb, but decided to wait and see if Gipfel would try something, but of course he's really too far away in GC to try, makes little sense to try a GC attack to win nothing most likely, or even if it's a lot 1', when he's over 2' back... Then ok, try the sieb at the 6-6-6, worked well, so continue, at first Phoenix didn't help, joined, then seemed likely to go through. Belhassen blocked the Coelho attack, good, having Eiffel as second option is nice. But had Coderch in for sprint, but not Belhassen, put it in, but after the last second. That really pisses me off.... what an idiot. Yes, I wasn't favorite with Belhassen either, he has only 54 sprint, but having 2 options seemed nice, only Gipfel with 58-58 clearly stronger. 54-60 Phoenix, 54-56 for me, hanging on the right ones can work.

In the end the sprint went better than could be expected for me, second with Eiffel finally, but well, wanted to win, think with 2 guys sprinting the chances just were better. Argh.

Tomorrow more of the same? In a way seems less inviting than today, further to go and all. But one positive side effect from today could be that T-Mobile doesn't even try the sprint anymore, opens up the race a lot. Gipfel still the favorite, Brandt, Boulanger, let's see what he does tomorrow, as only favorite who knows, maybe he joins the escape too! Let Phoenix work, counter by Eiffel/Apicella, GC Win, perfect. Or maybe just something like today. Belhassen promised to sprint tomorrow though.
Kraftsystemrevision! Include the distance!
Basics reform: Give blue a chance!
Don't punish bugusers. We all have to use bugs, since most of them are declared as "features"!

Gipfelstuermer
Posts: 1528
Joined: Wed Jul 13, 2011 10:43 am
Location: Weltenbummler
Contact:

Re: Humuhumunukunukuapuaa Tour 15h

Post by Gipfelstuermer » Thu Dec 17, 2020 10:52 pm

Stage 10, 124km short, hilly stage, but more hilly than yesterday. Yesterday only a +6 at 24km before the finish, today +6 +6 +6 at 24km before the finish and another +6 at 19km before the finish. Interestingly, T-Mobile-A mentioned that he likes Humuhumunukunukuapuaa because it has some stages for hill sprinters. Well, that's only half-true. If it is a 8-team race, of which 2 have a hill sprinter and they have some good helpers for these hill sprinters, yes, then it is a good tour for hill sprinters. But actually every December Tour should have something for hill sprinters in such a case with strong hill sprinter teams. And not even with two strong hill sprinters you always get a hill sprint....

... for example today, Big Donkey and Phoenix saw the opportunity to sieb the hill sprinters and instead ride for their classics. Not easy for Big Donkey because Belhassen 54 sprint and Eiffel 56 sprint not the biggest chances. Makes sense that his original plan was to go in escape. Also not sure if best move by Phoenix. Stage chances for Coelho with 60 sprint, yes. Slightly better green chances for Schiwkow, yes. But breaking the cooperation with T-Mobile and me? Can be dangerous. If T-Mobile and me start to prefer attacking... unlikely that it will change anything in GC, but might make life harder for him, even if only 3 stages are left.

Anyway, so Big Donkey and Phoenix riding for the classics, T-Mobile and me in the back. T-Mobile waited 9'' for his Scinto guy, probably a mistake, but even without waiting, probably we don't catch Big Donkey and Phoenix. But of course if they have to ride hard in front, decreases their chances to win in front... I made a mistake, too. Made DeWit a helper today and put fighting off, so he wasn't in first group. Lost some seconds in GC, but doesn't really matter. Thing that mattered was with DeWit might have better chances in a sprint. But actually, if he is there, Phoenix and Donkey might not ride. Coelho and Belhassen vs. a 57-58-58 train from me would be hard. Like this, 58-58 train looked beatable. However, I preferred to put Kapusta on Eiffel, Brandt on Coelho. Good if they attack and good if they sprint. Worked nicely. Brandt started the sprint from Coelho's wheel for Eiffel and Kapusta. Eiffel started at 150m for his chance to grab seconds. Kapusta took the win. (Little Detail: Belhassen ended up not sprinting. Rare mistake by the Big Donkey. Good for Eiffel in GC, but I don't think that was the plan)

Stage win 4 during our own tour! From 4 different riders! Bergsteinsson, Brandt, Boulanger and today Kapusta. Superb! And now 4-4 between Phoenix and me in the stage win fight.

But I almost wish I didn't win. 4-4 is too much. Hopefully T-Mob, AAD and Confi will get their stage wins, too, but difficult with only 3 stages left. Also, I had Kuchen today and I was supposed to pick up my new S-Works Tarmac from the local bike shop. Too many highlights in one day! Plan was to pick up the bike, but not to win the stage. Turns out I win the stage and the bike is not yet ready to be picked up. So will pick it up tomorrow and probably not win the stage :D

Another problem: This Kapusta is too successful for his awful training. National Champion, Andes stage & now Humuhumunukunukuapuaa stage. So give him one last chance? If he trains mountain on Sunday, maybe keep him in the team.

Statistics:

Stage wins:
2 - Ljuben Schiwkow (Team-Phoenix)
1 - Andrea Siegemund (Girl Power)
1 - Eitan Hershko (Team-Phoenix)
1 - Jäger-LeCultre
1 - Boas Bergsteinsson (Gipfelstuermer)
1 - Jamiro Coelho (Team-Phoenix)
1 - Bartholomäus Brandt (Gipfelstuermer)
1 - Fabian Messerli (Big Donkey)
1 - Bastien Boulanger (Gipfelstuermer)
1 - Kristian Kapusta (Gipfelstuermer)

Stage wins by teams:
4 - Team-Phoenix
4 - Gipfelstuermer
1 - Girl Power
1 - Jäger-LeCultre
1 - Big Donkey

Stages in leader jersey:
7 - Ljuben Schiwkow (Team-Phoenix)
2 - Tim Eiffel (Big Donkey)
1 - Andrea Siegemund (Girl Power)
1 - Theodor Tomaselli (Jäger-LeCultre)

Stages in leader jersey by teams:
7 - Team-Phoenix
2 - Big Donkey
1 - Girl Power
1 - Jäger-LeCultre
GIP MASTERPLAN
Gameplay: Flexible Min-Tact. Improve Sprint System. Windkante.
Marketing: Re-attract old players. Advertisement. Social Media.
New Players: Fair Start Budget, New Tutorial.
Fairplay: Improve FPC features, Fair Prize Money Disribution.

Robyklebt
Posts: 10021
Joined: Thu Feb 11, 2010 6:50 pm
Contact:

Re: Humuhumunukunukuapuaa Tour 15h

Post by Robyklebt » Fri Dec 18, 2020 7:53 am

Gipfelstuermer wrote:
Thu Dec 17, 2020 10:52 pm
Rare mistake by the Big Donkey.
I wish it was rare....
Kraftsystemrevision! Include the distance!
Basics reform: Give blue a chance!
Don't punish bugusers. We all have to use bugs, since most of them are declared as "features"!

Robyklebt
Posts: 10021
Joined: Thu Feb 11, 2010 6:50 pm
Contact:

Re: Humuhumunukunukuapuaa Tour 15h

Post by Robyklebt » Fri Dec 18, 2020 7:25 pm

I enjoyed today's race.... somehow was fun.

Big group goes, after some early chasing Phoenix let's go, we gain 7 minutes. I stop. Reason? More than one.
-No need to ride further if we want we get the stage pretty sure. Unless somebody in the back starts chasing really really hard, but if we react there normally we should have no problem
-Make it harder for Phoenix. A group at 20 minutes is highly relaxing, 0 danger of anybody being used as a relay station. Stay within reach and he has to pay attention he has to at least ride a bit at times, if we are at 20 or 15 minutes, he doesn't have to do anything until the last 30 or so km.
-Keep Swift reasonably fresh, Loeve with 62 sprint is hard to beat, even if I manage to sieb him at 7 8, with his flat-downhill good chances to come back. If T Mobile and Girl continue I get a second half option. If they had continued then later Swift would either have attacked, or made tempo to assure that we come to the last climb with fresh riders... then trying to drop Loeve with Coderch.
-Apicella, red. If they stop riding, Phoenix comes too close, then I just start making tempo with Apicella in the hill and see if I get red points instead of them...
-Maybe with Vic in front and the group not too far Kapusta tries something? But seeing that Vic wasn't a very useful rider in front, no downhill thought it was very unlikely.

All stopped, for a while looked like it could be the Apicella version, since Phoenix re-started tempo to make us ride again, but well, at 5', no danger yet. They restarted, restopped, Phoenix not being stupid realized that riding close wasn't helping him either, so stopped again too.

Then, attack by Brandt, excellent, so after all my stopping worked, just not with the expected rider. Wasn't hanging on Kapusta or DeWit either. There I was for riding in the group, but no T-Mob and Girl didn't want too.. .and downhill unfortunately Mr. Swift isn't very useful. I think if we rode Brandt doesn't catch us, but in restropect was better for me like this. He doesn't catch us, he stops, Phoenix doesn't need to ride anymore, like this he had to ride the whole stage. I of course hoped to keep the helpers as long as possible, sieb the rest at 7-8, finish with Brandt, steal the win, somehow. But like this was fine too, by riding all together, except when Girl and AAD weren't, we forced Phoenix in the back to ride harder, so Cordech kept riding even if it really didn't make much sense from a stage win point of view at that point. But keep the pressure on Phoenix up, get as many of his riders under reg as possible. But Phoenix managed very well, using Hershko (that, I didn't like, need him for my sprint win on Sunday), Trzetrzelewska (got the Trze part right! but then had linka instead of lewska), keeping his more important riders for tomorrow fitter. Then the last climb, Coderch yes alone, Brandt in tempo, rest pushed out, but not dropped, ok, then for me really made little sense to ride at all anymore, 62 sprint for Loeve, more energy at that point, so went out, came back in in the end, didn't make a difference anymore anyway. I hoped to get Loeve's wheel, somehow then getting second place, but Kenin was stronger too. Went at 200 from position 3, Brandt almost got me back in the last 50 meters to get third.... I thought I would beat him for sure, he must have had even less energy, but no. So Loeve an easy sprint win, (of course he couldn't ride as much as I did before the last climb, sieb danger, but a bit more would have been ok) so now he has his win too. Good.

GC, no big change, tomorrow of course Apicella-Eiffel will still try something. Somehow. REg, Sarde should be under reg, but the rest.. Pana with his reg if, then minimally, Annemans probably yes, Hershko too (this is bad for Sunday) So hm, not such a big advantage there really. But we'll see tomorrow.

Red: Apicella not that interested, but yes, it could happen that he gets it, with 20 points in the end, twice 10 points early, if at the cat 2 there is a chance to get those points he might try.
Green: Interesting, but looks good for Gipfel. Brandt under reg, but how much? With help he still could do ok and score little points in the end... Plus in the final stage with an attack, he has his chances, +3 is not that easy to block either. If not Boulanger, at +3 he is stronger than Celestino, now doubt. Rest really has no chance anymore. But that could be expected. really. Even if Hershko had been there and won the great Messerli stage the 3 others would still be ahead, at least I think. So 2 riders for Gipfel, 2 options, he has to be the favorite now. Will be interesting to see on Sunday.
Kraftsystemrevision! Include the distance!
Basics reform: Give blue a chance!
Don't punish bugusers. We all have to use bugs, since most of them are declared as "features"!

Robyklebt
Posts: 10021
Joined: Thu Feb 11, 2010 6:50 pm
Contact:

Re: Humuhumunukunukuapuaa Tour 15h

Post by Robyklebt » Fri Dec 18, 2020 7:46 pm

Dammit, Coderch only 4th! Only really checked the result now, wanted to make helper settings for tomorrow.. oh, only 4th. Seemed third by almost nothing in the sprint, grrr, 4th by almost nothing. Anti-Gipfel tomorrow!
Kraftsystemrevision! Include the distance!
Basics reform: Give blue a chance!
Don't punish bugusers. We all have to use bugs, since most of them are declared as "features"!

User avatar
flockmastoR
Posts: 3132
Joined: Thu Feb 18, 2010 11:42 pm
Contact:

Re: Humuhumunukunukuapuaa Tour 15h

Post by flockmastoR » Sat Dec 19, 2020 2:05 pm

At least one stage win for me. Can relax now a bit more. Still all the little failures during the tour are annoying.

Loeve clear needs to survive the +7,+8 with Brandt in the group it seemed harder to achive that, so at least have the Girl rider with me when siebed and try to get back. Girl with a puller who didn't ride so probably helper for a long time and more mountain, so couldn't risk to be siebed while Girl stays. That was the reason for less tempo before the hill, if girl is in earlier, me too of course, probably you sieb us but I can hope to get help by Girl or at least the Brandt, Corderch group does NOT receive help by her. After the hill the +4 was still a fear. Expected Girl to be out more too after the hill, lucky me there was still always anybody in tempo with Loeve.
Boaz Trakhtenbrot:
  • Winner Giro 2022
  • 10 GC wins
  • 16.609 Eternal Points
__________________
Schrödinger's Dogs: Alive & Dead

Gipfelstuermer
Posts: 1528
Joined: Wed Jul 13, 2011 10:43 am
Location: Weltenbummler
Contact:

Re: Humuhumunukunukuapuaa Tour 15h

Post by Gipfelstuermer » Sat Dec 19, 2020 2:21 pm

Yesterday as I predicted. Picked up my brand new S-Works Tarmac and that was the highlight of the day. No stage win this time. Instead, AAD finally! After multiple escapes he deserves it!

Ourselves... we tried a GC attack with Brandt this time. A bit hopeless with 3' disadvantage but you never know... if Donkey joins for GC or others join for the stage or Phoenix sleeps... well, none of that happened. Nobody followed my attack with Zevenbergen/Brandt, the escape worked ok-ish but not very well and Phoenix made no mistake. Still 35'' won by Brandt but doesn't make a difference in GC. For green, it can be interesting. Boulanger and Brandt both with chances to beat this Celestino guy. Let's see what happens on Haleakala today and on the last stage tomorrow. Normally the climbers will win today and the sprinters tomorrow but who knows.

Statistics:

Stage wins:
2 - Ljuben Schiwkow (Team-Phoenix)
1 - Andrea Siegemund (Girl Power)
1 - Eitan Hershko (Team-Phoenix)
1 - Jäger-LeCultre
1 - Boas Bergsteinsson (Gipfelstuermer)
1 - Jamiro Coelho (Team-Phoenix)
1 - Bartholomäus Brandt (Gipfelstuermer)
1 - Fabian Messerli (Big Donkey)
1 - Bastien Boulanger (Gipfelstuermer)
1 - Kristian Kapusta (Gipfelstuermer)
1 - Michel Loeve (Alive and Dead)

Stage wins by teams:
4 - Team-Phoenix
4 - Gipfelstuermer
1 - Girl Power
1 - Jäger-LeCultre
1 - Big Donkey
1 - Alive and Dead

Stages in leader jersey:
8 - Ljuben Schiwkow (Team-Phoenix)
2 - Tim Eiffel (Big Donkey)
1 - Andrea Siegemund (Girl Power)
1 - Theodor Tomaselli (Jäger-LeCultre)

Stages in leader jersey by teams:
8 - Team-Phoenix
2 - Big Donkey
1 - Girl Power
1 - Jäger-LeCultre
GIP MASTERPLAN
Gameplay: Flexible Min-Tact. Improve Sprint System. Windkante.
Marketing: Re-attract old players. Advertisement. Social Media.
New Players: Fair Start Budget, New Tutorial.
Fairplay: Improve FPC features, Fair Prize Money Disribution.

Robyklebt
Posts: 10021
Joined: Thu Feb 11, 2010 6:50 pm
Contact:

Re: Humuhumunukunukuapuaa Tour 15h

Post by Robyklebt » Sat Dec 19, 2020 7:58 pm

Second stage win, nice but don't really care, the main goal was the GC, got the 2 stages mostly by lucky circumstances, big goal failed.

How... Dickson and everybody else was right, stupid to ride for Eiffel and not Apicella. Absolutely no guarantee that I win it with Apicella, but seems easier.
Second big mistake of course was the Waimea Canyon stage, where Eiffel didn't follow, and then decided to eat an extra 30" to keep DeWit further away from Apicella since DeWit wasn't interested in staying closer himself. If I'm these 30" closer today, I still have no chance with the attack I think, but the pressure on Phoenix is higher.

But in the end more than my mistakes it's really Phoenix that defended very well once he was ahead. Waimea was a bit of a lucky break IMO, but in normal chasing situations like today and yesterday he was very impressive. Never overreacted, never fell for my attempts to intimidate him, provoke mistakes (by sending riders ahead). Usually the threat of an attack is harder to deal with than the attack that has happened, but this all seems to have left Phoenix completely cold. Either he's a superb manager or he's too dumb to see that an attack is possible :lol: I fear it's the first.

And that was the story of today, Cordech mostly ahead to have him work or be worried about an early attack. Of course today there wasn't really the terrain to do anything early 1 vs 1, no chance, all started with the first cat 2, but even there what you can gain by going early is very little. Phoenix clearly realized that too and just let the group go, which was slightly annoying, how was I going to at least try to win the stage now?

Anyway, group very likely won when I started some little games in the back, Waihu Spring trail, somehow managed to have 4 riders in front vs only Schiwkow after that. Icecold Phoenix was a bit too icecold there IMO, but with the downhill coming...and distance wise all very short, unlikely he would get a energy disadvantage big enough for Apicella to go and gain 45"... So no big issue.

Final climb, attack by Eiffel with Belhassen and passengers, Kapusta helps, even if clearly weaker, Phoenix controls in his usual icecold unexcited manner, and it was always under control. Finally minimal time gain for Eiffel, which he could have avoided if he wanted, but there was no reason, while Apicella came in with Schiwkow after a short attack attempt late.

Stage in front, IMO AAD and T-Mobile should simply have siebed us in the Waihu thing. Cordech and Kenin. Try there, if it works good, change to green as soon as we give up in the back. Hoped Coderch would stay, but wasn't sure, having more mountain certainly would have helped... and once over the top depending on fighting might have joined. Or if it doesn't work nicely, ride back with Hofbauer. And then try again at the 8, the first one, without riding red before on the 6. Anyway, was happy they didn't, Came at some point, rode a bit, then out, then attacked, caught, then out again, follewed an attack, at this point I was third anyway, so didn't ride. Then at a 6 close to the end they ride only green, AAD, Harrison, so ok, I try again, not much conviction, but if he goes green. And he couldn't follow, 11", saved 7", I'll take it.

Tomorrow Messerli wants to win the sprint... but on +3 not so easy, let's what the other stage favorites do too.
Kraftsystemrevision! Include the distance!
Basics reform: Give blue a chance!
Don't punish bugusers. We all have to use bugs, since most of them are declared as "features"!

Weezel
Posts: 251
Joined: Sun Feb 28, 2010 1:26 am
Contact:

Re: Humuhumunukunukuapuaa Tour 15h

Post by Weezel » Sat Dec 19, 2020 8:41 pm

First I was a little bit pissed about the donkey sucking and then attacking.
But he has the worst sprint-skills, he lost yesterday - so at some point I can understand him.
Should have followed him, but as Harrison was the one in tempo, I was at him.

I'm glad, that we got the mountain jersey, so at least one entry for the palmares. Tomorrow it will be a hard fight against Gipfelstürmer for the sprint-jersey. At +3 Boulanger is probably the better rider, but let's see. I don't think, that Messerli is that chanceless at +3.
Maybe I should force a 20-Mann-Group without Brandt and other contenders for green, so I can rescue my second jersey.

Let's see, if my sprint-training makes sence or not. In Celestino we trust! He already lost the GC on the last stage of Schnitzeltour "Andhra Pradesh" to Boulanger, time for revenge...
Manager von T-Mobile-A

User avatar
flockmastoR
Posts: 3132
Joined: Thu Feb 18, 2010 11:42 pm
Contact:

Re: Humuhumunukunukuapuaa Tour 15h

Post by flockmastoR » Sun Dec 20, 2020 4:09 pm

What the donkey forgot to mention is, that he wanted to destroy the group to get Gipfel help in his (not promissing) GK attack. This also had effect, he went out and T-Mob went out too. Great to see him destroying groups were he didn't contribute a single km of tempo to bring his energyless guy to a point where he can fight for the stage win!
Boaz Trakhtenbrot:
  • Winner Giro 2022
  • 10 GC wins
  • 16.609 Eternal Points
__________________
Schrödinger's Dogs: Alive & Dead

Weezel
Posts: 251
Joined: Sun Feb 28, 2010 1:26 am
Contact:

Re: Humuhumunukunukuapuaa Tour 15h

Post by Weezel » Sun Dec 20, 2020 5:30 pm

Second place for Celestino, he likes the bigger sprints with more teams it seems.
So we secured sprint-jersey like we did with the climber-jersey one day before - great. Not a single racewin in 14 days, but we are happy with this - also much money for our next rider.

Thanks for a nice tour, congrats to all winners.
Manager von T-Mobile-A

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 3 guests