September 2022

[Gipfelstuermer]

http://www.cycling4freaks.com/radsport/ ... al PDF.pdf
Red colored races are not on the real date.

[Gipfelstuermer]

Some things to be discussed for September:

1) Luxembourg and Cro Race. 3 editions planned each. IMO makes sense given the number of players. But with Ain and Norway we accepted 6 editions parallel… the best we had on a day was 47 players recently, I think... so clearly the trend goes up. So Luxembourg and Cro could both be 4 editions, too, if players demand it. But I leave it to the morning people to ask for Luxembourg and to the early evening people to ask for Croatia.

2) Luxembourg Cat. 3: I think that's what it deserves after it has been upgraded to 2.Pro in 2020. Participation from World Tour Teams is generally very strong. Last year, only World Tour riders placed in the Top 10 (Almeida, Hirschi, Cattaneo, Gaudu, Nibali etc....).

3) World Championship: Just like NCs, not the top priority for development at the moment. But priority for calendar? I would say yes.Why not have it as a normal race in the calendar? With just one time (20h like in the past if I remember correctly?) and, if you want, some morning/afternoon race for those who have no time in the evening to ride the World Championship? The jersey will be added to the winner manually in the database. So perhaps not immediately after the race, but let's say Siegerehrung within 24h.

Comment, complain, put other things up for discussion.

[lennylenny]

what are the red races in the preview? still up for discussion?

[lennylenny]

checked Quebec and Montreal, same route as usual

[Hansa]

20h croatia is fine for me, but croatia has not many important races parallel? so 4 editions would be fine there i guess

[Pokemon Club]

WC is really needed this year?

[Robyklebt]

You guys are fast....

Red? Is mentioned in the PM!

But ok:
Red means: Not on real date. Right now often makes little sense. Fourmies for example is on the same day as Montreal. With the Vuelta parallel. Better to have it on 2 days. Once we are back up in numbers of course I'll try to propose real dates again, I'm a purist on that after all, but sometimes pragmatism wins. But if a majority wants real dates, we can do that now, for Montreal-Fourmies would be 2-2

Other comments explanations from my original proposal, that has already been changed. (In theory no problem, in practice it is one, more on that later)

No Britain; Vuelta, Canadian WT races (+Fourmies) parallel. Not enough managers

Luxembourg 3 editions: Not 4 because it's full of real races in parallel, we have to think about 1 day races fans too, not have them being the victims of low participation all the time.
Cro: Same thing, Agostoni, but then Emilia on Oct 1st, 3 other real races on Oct 2. (Actually seeing it again now probably should put one of the 3 races there to September, will propose that later this month...)
Times for these 2 stage races: Of course can change: Cut once the morning, once the early evening. Simplistic thinking: Lux 21 weakest in the morning, cut there, Ain weakest in the early evening, so those 2 times cut. But can be changes (Personally I'd love to see the afternoon cut, since I don't plan on riding either of the stage races.) Only 3 editions though much better than 4 IMO.

WC: In my original proposal question if it's techically possible to ride it or not. If yes, Paris Chauny Saturday better. If not, Sunday for Paris Chauny.

New comments:

GP Isbergues is missing. After this we change our deal immediately, you won't change anything in the PDF in the future before posting, I don't want to have to do another double check after it's posted, I'm not going to catch everything each time after all.

WC with normal teams makes absolutely no sense IMO, if technically possible the old system, as flawed as that was, as a normal race makes little sense.

Categories: Lux up to 3, why not... don't see any other pressing issues on categories. But should always be checked.

[Robyklebt]

Already 20.08., no comments since the 12.......

No opinions around?

WC as 1 edition normal race (both ITT and RR) not many comments, Gipfel presumably for it, me against it, Pokemon sounded doubtful not sure if that's enough to classify him as against, but for the moment I do

[flockmastoR]

Already 20.08., no comments since the 12.......

No opinions around?

WC as 1 edition normal race (both ITT and RR) not many comments, Gipfel presumably for it, me against it, Pokemon sounded doubtful not sure if that's enough to classify him as against, but for the moment I do

I am against giving WC jerseys for a normal team race, otherwise, why not race it, better than doing a pure fantasy race, just not give it the WC credit (category, jersey)

[schappy]

It is something special but it could be a nice race. But the winner of field 2 should not be a World Champion

[Gipfelstuermer]

I am against giving WC jerseys for a normal team race, otherwise, why not race it, better than doing a pure fantasy race, just not give it the WC credit (category, jersey)

Could be an option... what category then? 3? Not a classic, but more relevant than fantasy race.

4 editions like normal races? Would mean no parallel race, I guess. So no Gooikse Pijl, Isbergues and Paris-Chauny, or those on an alternative date.

[Pokemon Club]

I am against too

[Robyklebt]

No jersey wanted seems rather clear at this point.

WC RR then as normal race... but 4 editions, a 266 km race, on a Sunday, seems too much. 3 editions, 10-15-20/21, then hopefully at at least we have halfway decent participation. Cat...last year seems we did only the U24 without it being WC as cat 1, but IMO cat 2 or 3 both works. Let's say 3 to reward the weekend warriors ready to spend over 2 hours for c4f on a weekend.

Paris Chauny on Saturday.

ITT: IMO actually we could do it as WC. Meaning. 1 edition, 2 riders per team (or more if 4 or so are wanted) ridden as a normal race BUT the winner gets the jersey. Then parallel 3 editions of either Gooikse Pijl or Isbergues, the other one with 2 editions on Monday parallel to Pantani. For ITT 1 edition IMO sort of makes sense. And then can be a WC too.

But we can do 2 editions, no jersey as well, then it would simply be the monthly ITT.

[Schartner Bombe]

Cro race at 9.00 is perfect

[CircleCycle]

1 edition and the jersey for ITT would be nice

[Gipfelstuermer]

1 edition and the jersey for ITT would be nice

But treat ITT and Road Race differently? Because less important to be online and make settings?

But you still need to be online and make some settings, even for the ITT... can't race it completely offline... so if we like it for the ITT, we can do the same for the road race? Make it Cat.3 and some lucky rider gets the jersey.

[Robyklebt]

Why not treat them differently? They are different last time I checked.

Anyway, with 1 in support for that, right now the "no jersey faction" is still in front if my counting is correct.

[Robyklebt]

In the meantime I started designing



Possibly more intermediate sprints there? They give out a jersey for it....
Mostly flat, the first 2 GPMs siebable, +6 +7, last one +5


I will do the very annoying Tour du Doubs tomorrow.

For what else remains to be designed, see first post. Canadian races and Fourmies the same, Fourmies some changes in where the sprints are only it seems.

For other stuff still time to have an opinion, even if it's running out slowly...

[Gipfelstuermer]

Profile: http://www.radsportfreaks.de/radsport/p ... 2022_me_rr
Min-Tact: km248
Wollongong Loop: 0 0 0 2 -2 0 0 5 -3 8 -6 -2 -1 0 -1 2 -2 0


Profile: http://www.radsportfreaks.de/radsport/p ... 022_me_itt
Min-Tact: km1

[Gipfelstuermer]

Profile: http://www.radsportfreaks.de/radsport/p ... lux2022_01
Type: Hilly
Min-Tact: km150


Profile: http://www.radsportfreaks.de/radsport/p ... lux2022_02
Type: Hilly
Min-Tact: km150


Profile: http://www.radsportfreaks.de/radsport/p ... lux2022_03
Type: Hilly
Min-Tact: km168


Profile: http://www.radsportfreaks.de/radsport/p ... lux2022_04
Type: ITT
Min-Tact: km1


Profile: http://www.radsportfreaks.de/radsport/p ... lux2022_05
Type: Hilly
Min-Tact: km162

Ok, finally done, not easy designing this with their useless map, even though I know many of the roads...

KOM Categorisation:

Cat.3: 5-3-2-1 (they call it HC)
Cat.4: 3-2-1 (they call it cat1)

Time Boni normal at the finish line: 10-6-4
Points at the finish line: 20-16-13-11-9-7-5-3-2-1

But I guess for now we don't adjust those things. Would be ok to only adjust for Grand Tours, I guess.

[Gipfelstuermer]

Final PDF uploaded.

[Robyklebt]

First race online, check for mistakes as usual.

More races on tomorrow.

[Robyklebt]

Few more races on.

Missing ones, Wallonie and Agostoni change a bit, but no nice gpx found yet. Wallonie the normal finish though climb on *
Agostoni a bit longer, part of it between the last climb and the finish
Primus/Van Petegem has some sort of info too, seems slighly different.

Rest either I already forgot or has no info available yet. Only checked 1 day races.

Hilly and flat pavé on as well, for form... wasn't sure if we need hilly with Wallonie there, if that qualifies, but put one in anyway.
Flat pavé not sure either, Gooikse sometimes had pavé, last year not, so... ?

[Robyklebt]

So Luxembourg ready to be uploaded I guess? I'll wait until tomorrow just to be sure you don't want to do any changes

And of course protesting the fact that you expect me to keep track of your edits, instead of posting a simple "Lux done"

[Gipfelstuermer]

So Luxembourg ready to be uploaded I guess? I'll wait until tomorrow just to be sure you don't want to do any changes

And of course protesting the fact that you expect me to keep track of your edits, instead of posting a simple "Lux done"

Lux done